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Motorola could be on the hook for $16.2 billion in patent dispute with Apple

Posted: , by Alan F.

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Motorola could be on the hook for $16.2 billion in patent dispute with Apple
Motorola and Apple were in court Friday for a case in which the former is suing the Cupertino based company. Motorola alleges that Apple's iCloud infringes on patents for existing technology used for synchronization. During the hearing, Apple estimated that if Motorola seeks an preliminary injunction against iCloud now, it would have to post bond of $2.7 billion a year to cover Apple's losses in case a ban gets overturned. Considering that Florian Mueller of FOSS Patents was told by a Motorola attorney that the case could last until 2018, Motorola could be on the hook for as much as $16.2 billion to Apple.

While earlier reports said that it was likely that Motorola would win at least one of its German suits, Apple does have the right to set a bond figure to get damages in case it does win in appeal, a process that could take years. In Germany, those who receive a preliminary injunction against a product and/or company, can have it enforced immediately, even before appeal. However, as Apple pointed out in its bond request, if the preliminary injunction is reversed at the end of the process, the company whose product was banned could seek damages. In Germany, the end of the process means that the ruling can no longer be appealed, or that the next higher court refuses to hear the case.

To protect its interest, Apple could seek a bond from Motorola that originally was thought to be $2.7 billion for the entire length of the appeal process. Apple has now clarified this to be an annual figure that would be multiplied by the number of years that the case could last. Apple might have to prove to the courts that the product in question, in this case iCloud, generates revenue of $2.7 billion annually in Germany. A hearing is scheduled for February 3, 2012, when the court could reveal its decision on how much Apple's bond is worth.

Sometimes a patent holder will go along with posting a bond in order to have leverage against its opponent to work out a settlement. Until the court rules on February 3rd, there is no reason for Motorola to do anything. 

source: FossPatents via AppleInsider

64 Comments
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posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:36 10

1. Sniggly (Posts: 6761; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)


Well now. Quite a gamble. If Motorola follows through on the injunction, their lawyers better make damn sure that they have an ironclad case.

On the other hand, this seems like a last ditch threat by Apple to dissuade Motorola from kicking its ass in court. "If you lose, I'll get SO MUCH FREAKING MONEY FROM YOU! Bwahahahahahaha!!!!"

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 15:23 6

10. remixfa (Posts: 13902; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)


id like to see apple prove they make 2 billion a year in germany on icloud which just launched. doubt moto is too worried.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 04:41

42. ledbetterp3 (Posts: 466; Member since: 31 Aug 2011)


Yea, go Motorola, use your money to improve your all ready great products. They might've deserved it, but I have to admit, I don't like patent wars with apple, they are probably now going to look for the stupidest things to sue you for...

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 04:42

43. ledbetterp3 (Posts: 466; Member since: 31 Aug 2011)


Which I don't think is much of a problem for them, but is annoying, and I hate reading Phonearena everyday about Apple suing someone because they made something better than them...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:39 14

2. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


Lately Apple is just making me mad.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 20:30 1

33. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)


You're mad at Apple because Motorola sued them? You must be a really smart person :)

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:39 4

41. hepresearch (unregistered)


If you are Motorola, living in the Android apartment complex, and you see Apple, who lives alone in the great and spacious iOS mansion on the big hill just outside of town, go after a bunch of your neighbors, like HTC and Samsung, and then you hear grumblings in the community that your landlord, Google, and maybe even you, are the next target(s), would you not go on the offensive first, rather than wait for the inevitable and suffer an identical fate?

Nah... never mind, I already know your answer... something to do with Motorola running away or jumping off the nearest cliff, no doubt?

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 07:09 6

46. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


530gemini, you know what, my dad taught me to never argue with a fool cos ppl wont see the difference between me and the fool, if you don't get my point why I'm mad at Apple, then I guess that proves my point that ur a dumb fool. Pls dont reply, i got more thing to deal with than your ignorant cells less brain, don't have energy to waste on idiots, later setlatla toe!

posted on 05 Dec 2011, 15:58

62. stealthd (Posts: 927; Member since: 12 Jun 2011)


Are you five years old?

posted on 06 Dec 2011, 05:58

63. hepresearch (unregistered)


As usual... gemini is not only after the Fandroids, but also the iFans who fail to show complete allegiance by the obligatory lock-step behavior...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:39 6

3. gallitoking (Posts: 4684; Member since: 17 May 2011)


TWell well well if it isnt Moto using Apple playbook and I can hear the fandroids clapping in jubilee from here.. got to go before I get run over by the fandroids..

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:53 12

7. Sniggly (Posts: 6761; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)


Because you know that we applaud moves like this because it's mainly done in defense against Apple, right?

Motorola is the only major Android manufacturer to go after Apple first, and it was only after Apple spent years flipping off Motorola in response to Motorola's request for royalties on tech Apple used which Motorola spent decades developing.

Then Apple was like, "You know, we're allowed to use anyone's tech we want, but when we do, our products become special unique snowflakes which NOBODY is allowed to emulate, mimic, or evoke in THEIR designs!"

And thus the metric s**t ton of lawsuits was dropped on Android.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:06 6

14. Lucas777 (Posts: 2121; Member since: 06 Jan 2011)


um first off it wasnt apple who started this... it was microsoft.. and they do more anticompetitive, money taking, product claiming, whatever u want to call it than apple.. why should apple not try and make money off of products that look very similar? u dont see them suing wp7.. thats because its not the same...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:42 2

21. tacohunter (Posts: 408; Member since: 06 Nov 2011)


I agree with Lucas777

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:46 8

22. remixfa (Posts: 13902; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)


apple isnt trying to make money lucas. apple has yet to sue any of these companies for damages like MS does. Apple's end game in every suit is banning the company from selling any products in that country. that is the difference.

If they wanna sue and get money for patent infringement, fine. if they wanna sue because they are losing market share and would rather ban than innovate, that is not fine. thats the difference.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 17:05 2

23. iHateCrapple (Posts: 734; Member since: 12 Feb 2010)


I don't recall MS starting ANY of this?

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:02

35. JGuinan007 (Posts: 627; Member since: 19 May 2011)


You wouldn't have MS doen't like to go to court they say hey you used my patents give me 20$ for every unit you sell you know what I like you so I'm gonna cut you a break give me 10$ a unit and make my products and I won't break your legs

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 16:43 2

57. DeviantDroid (Posts: 51; Member since: 28 Apr 2011)


Probably because Microsoft settles out of court and they are not the biggest asses out there.... Apple doesn't want money they want products banned.... That's anti-competative......

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 18:29 3

27. thebikerboi2 (Posts: 144; Member since: 01 Apr 2011)


well heres the deal, apple arent suing everyone off because of tthere technologies, its because there using android. let me take you back to when these two operating systems were in there early development, at the time google and apple enjoyed a close relationship. Apple even had google executives as members of there board of directors.

during this time apple created ios 1. little time passsed before google released its mobile os, android 1.0. apple felt betrayed by google and began a lawsute campaign against any android device to which they could find any excuse possiible. steve jobs even said that he would spend every bit of his companies assets to bring android down.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 08:56 4

51. remixfa (Posts: 13902; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)


the biker,
if your going back in time, then u should go the whole way back in time to when android was created.. which was before iOS. Google bought Android long before steve jobs showed off iOS to anyone.

And if this yes yet another taco fake account, learn your damn lesson. They can track every account back to you and can/will keep banning them.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 11:05 1

54. geedup (banned) (Posts: 74; Member since: 01 Dec 2011)


Are you accusing every poster of being taco now? First this wasn't even pro Apple. He said they had a good relationship and then Steve Jobs got pissed at Google. That's all true. Also what a lame argument about android being in development before iPhone was announced. They had a whole year after iPhone was released to redo their OS. There's lots of things android took from iOS.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 12:59 3

56. remixfa (Posts: 13902; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)


yet, taco,
the only thing that actually changed after iOS was released was going from a motoQ/BB style device to a touchscreen/keyboard device.
I dont know how thats copying. Apple still doesnt have a keyboard option.

oh wait.. the world didnt start until apple said it could, right? lol

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 21:18

58. gallitoking (Posts: 4684; Member since: 17 May 2011)


sorry i didnt answer before Sniggly.. i just dont read bulls**t on weekends... ohh is still Sunday.... ohh well. Didnt read anyways... but knowing you.... either you put faked numbers or express your love for Moto and Android domination

posted on 05 Dec 2011, 08:29 1

61. remixfa (Posts: 13902; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)


why is it that it seems like only the apple crazies blind post and "reply" without even knowing what anyone has said? is it a side effect of fruit-brain washing?

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:46 12

4. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


My new iPhone 4 App is called iSueU, I'm loving it, it is teaching me how to steal ideas, and how to turn old technology into something somewhat new and call it groundbreaking, and go "This changes everything". But what I like the most is the fact that it's teaching me how to sue everyone that looks at my iPhone and wear the same colour [or color] t-shirt as me. This is the best App of the year. and it's free. go check it out on App Store.http://www.appstore.iDiots/useless.apple

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:48 8

5. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


Pls don't sue me Apple, I'm poor!

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:31 3

18. hepresearch (unregistered)


Apple attorney: Do not worry, Slim... debtor prison is not so bad...

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 07:12 3

47. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


hepresearch LOL, hehehehe!, my iPhone is not jail-broken, I'm fine inside the mental Apple jail, dont wanna go to any other prison, Apple psychological prison is enough for me [still luv my iPhone 4, just hate the limitations, thats all]

posted on 05 Dec 2011, 00:37 1

59. hepresearch (unregistered)


Hahaha... nice! Well played sir, well played...

My brother has had a 3GS for a couple years now, and his wife just got a 4S this week. We all were playing with Siri for a while this evening just for kicks and giggles... it was very entertaining, all sorts of funny little easter-eggish stuff. If I was not so skeptical and fiercely independent (as in, not too enthused with the latest smartphones, and unsatisfied with the costs and limitations involved, among many other things...), I might have transitioned to an iPhone by now. I do think that, for a phone that is difficult to root or otherwise modify on the OS software end (well, mods are, technically, unauthorized by Apple...), the iPhone works exceedingly well out-of-the-box. I am fairly sure my mobile OS-modding days are over at this point... I am too tired to keep going when things are way too different from what I am used to working with. At this point, in the new competing business models, there will always be either risks or limitations with new smartphones... either you take care of the risks yourself, or you accept the OEM limitations that are required to manage the risks on your behalf.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 14:48 2

6. som (Posts: 768; Member since: 10 Nov 2009)


Hay Samsung got a team mate to sue cApple.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 15:00 4

8. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


The last commandment of the deranged, late Steve Jobs - take out ANDROID

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 15:22 7

9. shamu11 (Posts: 19; Member since: 22 Oct 2011)


google is not taking over the world, they are defending us from apple!

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 15:26 4

11. vivek.ray (Posts: 22; Member since: 08 Apr 2011)


Most likely Apple is now seeing other competitors slowly taking off its share and will get back to dirty market tactics . Remember fall in Apple share when iPhone4S was announced .

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 15:58 3

12. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


Excellent article on APPLE:
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/apples-worldwide-war-on-samsung-and-android/9945?tag=nl.e550

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:05 2

13. lubba (Posts: 1310; Member since: 17 Jan 2011)


Without steve jobs vision of the iphone, the cell tech industry would not have boomed as it has right now. Including the ipod which he first revolutionized the portable music world and last the ipad which set the tab into full swing. Now i dont know who copied who but steve out right believes that google copied or stole apples ideas and set to nuke them up. $2.7 billion per year till 2018, that'll nuke motorola and google to the s**t hole. Good luck!

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 17:43 2

24. jacko (unregistered)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jUS1H8cCiA

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 07:25 5

48. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


jacko, so true, he didnt invent the smartphone, ipod, itunes and macs. he took the excising products and persuade people to pay enormous amount of money for them, the only praise I'll give Steve Jobs is how he persuade people to buy his products, cos "in my own opinion" Americans thrive on popularity and what teens like and don't like, and from what I've seen it's very easy to persuade and American teen into what is perceived to be popular and cool [and once they think something is cool, is very hard to convince them otherwise, which explains the iPhone popularity irrespective of the so called iPhone killer, and they are many of them out there]. CONCLUSION: Steve was gr8 @ persuading people, and making them pay more for something that should cost less and convinced them [including me with my iPhone] that when you move around or show off your Apple iDevice, you'll look cool and rich. JUST MY OPiNiON, all iFans are so gonna..... nevermind. {i guess everything with the "i" sells hay. hehehehe! haters on the left pls}

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 18:13 4

25. VZWuser76 (Posts: 1286; Member since: 04 Mar 2010)


There is no denying that, but it's not like it never would've happened without him either. The world had technology booms before Jobs, and it will have booms after him as well. Companies have come out with inventions before, followed by other companies that bring their own version of said invention to compete with the original.

The difference is most of the original companies didn't sue each other. Panasonic came out with the first modern flat screen tv. Do you see them suing LG, Samsung, Toshiba, Sony, & Sharp. Do you see laptop companies suing each other because their competitors' products look similar to theirs? No.

But, going by the story yesterday on this site on Apple's suggestions for Samsung to avoid further litigation, apparently the rectangle (rounded or not), the color black, a centered screen, and a horizontal earpiece are property of Apple.

Can you imagine the world we'd be in if car companies had done this. Ford would be the only company to have a four wheeled black car. Oldsmobile would be the only company to have the modern overhead valve V8, automatic transmission, and fromt wheel drive. The difference there was, if the competition came out with something selling better, they got back to work and tried to come up with a way to beat them in sales. They didn't sue for money or try to have the competition banned. But that hard work is what drove innovation, constantly keeping companies motivated to beat their competition.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 18:37 4

29. hepresearch (unregistered)


... and, in your perfect world, everyone has an iPhone. What a boring utopia...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:08 9

15. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


Steve Jobs stole plenty from those before him...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:26 3

16. tacohunter (Posts: 408; Member since: 06 Nov 2011)


You can't relativate.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 20:15 4

30. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


Relativate?

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:16 1

38. hepresearch (unregistered)


Relativate (rel-u-tiv-At); a verb.

1) to relate to a skewed perception in the mind of one who wishes to intentionally argue using familiar semantics applied to their own relative definitions of concepts in a common argument.

2) to understand the actual meaning of the argument of a fellow debater when the debater in question does not wish to be completely understood.

3) to be able to see through an intended connotation in a debate by relating to the relative definition secretly used by the opposition, often to their great surprise and alarm.

As used in a sentence: So far he has been unable to relativate, which is great for us!

As used in a sentence: Please understand that I will make this clear enough for you that you need not try to relativate... ahem! I mean, relate.

As used in a sentence: You cannot relativate! At least, I do not want you to relativate, because if you did, my secret would be out and my fellow iFans would be highly disappointed that you have any ability to understand what we are really talking about right in front of your face... and then I would feel really dumb, and start to publicly blush in embarrassment.

=8-D

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:27 5

17. hepresearch (unregistered)


When Apple sues another company, and wins, they get lots of money (case-in-point: HTC). When Apple sues another company, and loses, they settle for a pittance (case-in-point: Nokia). When another company sues Apple, either Apple will sue them for way more than they are being sued for (case-in-point: Nokia), or they have to pay Apple a freakin ton of money until they win (case-in-point: Motorola). If they lose, Apple eats the deposit for breakfast, and then counter-sues for even more money (case-in-point: Samsung). Somewhere, an Apple attorney is flipping a coin... Heads - I win! Tails - you lose!

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:33 4

19. InspectorGadget80 (Posts: 6215; Member since: 26 Mar 2011)


Motorola sbould take HALF IF APPLE'S fortune in damages "just saying". Motorola is one of my favortie phone manufacturer & I still have my Atrix. And now its Apple's turn TOO SUFFER.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 16:34 3

20. InspectorGadget80 (Posts: 6215; Member since: 26 Mar 2011)


Motorola sbould take HALF OF APPLE'S fortune in damages "just saying". Motorola is one of my favortie phone manufacturer & I still have my Atrix. And now its Apple's turn TOO SUFFER.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 18:21 4

26. androidsbiggestfan (Posts: 76; Member since: 09 Aug 2011)


Don't worry, Apple will fail soon enough, their following Blackberry's tracks from a few years ago. Hot booming phone flying off the shelves, then a lack of innovation and then a downfall. Think about it!

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 18:36 1

28. hepresearch (unregistered)


... unless Apple can convince the majority of consumers that the iOS devices are already perfect, and that innovation is no longer necessary. They could do what RIM and Nokia did before them, but without any fall from grace afterward as a consequence... fortunately, I do not think people are dumb enough to fall for that kind of thing for too long.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 20:17 4

31. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


lol, 4 million fell for it over the first weekend the iphone 4S was sold.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:29 3

40. hepresearch (unregistered)


Well, I am trying to give them the benefit of the doubt, and assume that insufficient time has passed for the majority of them to realize what is going on...

I am hoping that the iAddiction is not as hard to break as a nicotine addiction...

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 20:19 5

32. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v​=0jUS1H8cCiAr />
XDA TV - funny stuff
Steve Jobs did not invent, he persuaded you to buy what was already invented and persuaded the masses to overspend for it.

Steve Jobs would have made a great evangelist.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 07:39 4

49. SlimSoulja86 (Posts: 642; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)


if i could, I would give this 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 thumbs up, lol

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 09:18

52. steelicon (Posts: 309; Member since: 02 Apr 2011)


...but he WAS an evangelist!!!

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Cult_of_Apple
http://www.cultofmac.com/

See?

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 20:34 2

34. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)


It's funny to see android fanboys play attorney, hahahahaha.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:05 4

36. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


no one, not even yourself, really knows what goes on with this litigation - to say that APPLE is not over doing the litigation is preposterous.

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 11:06

55. geedup (banned) (Posts: 74; Member since: 01 Dec 2011)


Apple has won quite a few of their cases. In this case Motorola is the aggressor. Anyway if they were over doing it a
They wouldn't be winning cases.

posted on 05 Dec 2011, 00:56

60. hepresearch (unregistered)


1) The Truth: consumers everywhere will pay for the litigation between Apple and other OEMs no matter what.

The loser(s) will raise product prices due to having to cover the costs of the litigation (since they will, no doubt, bear the financial burden of the losing outcomes), and the winner(s) will raise product prices to prevent scarcity as demand for their now-suddenly-more-affordable product rises, and they must balance that demand through either pricing or supply increases.

2) The Truth: the most consistent winner(s) of the litigation series will drive the loser(s) into the ground as the price of products go up.

Losing OEMs cover their new costs of settlement or licensing, and winning OEMs make that much more profit since they can raise prices without having to cover additional litigation costs (traditionally covered by the losing OEMs), all while remaining competitive with the value offered by the products of their competitors. Thus, the losing OEMs become more expensive while delivering less and making less profit, while the winning OEMs make lots more profit and do not need to deliver any more than their competitors. The consistent winner ends up with all the profits eventually. Actual economic competition comes to an end as a result.

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:07 2

37. networkdood (Posts: 6261; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)


YouTube has a lot of interesting videos of when Steve Jobs introduces Mac or of the WOZ going through some APPLE history.

People do seem to worship Jobs and APPLE. Is it sadistic or ludicrous?

posted on 03 Dec 2011, 21:24 1

39. hepresearch (unregistered)


... is there an all-of-the-above option?

posted on 04 Dec 2011, 05:03 3

44. naga.appani (Posts: 36; Member since: 26 Nov 2011)


Apple will not exist by then and Motorols becomes a Googorola.. :P

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