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Is Apple unable to dream up a killer new product because it no longer attracts young talent?

Posted: , by Luis D.

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This t-shirt's message feels eerily appropriate.

This t-shirt's message feels eerily appropriate.


Got some engineering work under your belt and eyeing a job at Apple? The Guardian has a rather acerbic article that could make you reconsider depositing that CV to One Infinite Loop, Cupertino. The media got in touch with developer James Knight, a 27-year old ex-Google coder, who described the Apple "culture" as "negative, strict, and harsh", and the work environment as "very hostile". "You're gonna be working 60-80 hours a week and some VP will come yell at you at any moment." - said Knight.

"Several" Silicon Valley recruiters seem to share the coder's sentiment in what's explained as a trend that has been blooming slowly for years and has now manifested amidst the latest tech boom. In the past, Apple was revered in the Bay area tech circles, as career-minded specialists were careful not to tarnish any possibility of landing a job at One Infinite Loop. But right now, the mood appears to be shifting towards dismissing the very same opportunity as dodging a bullet. Programmers in the job market openly talk of issues such as "high-stress culture" and "cult of secrecy", which goes against office tendencies of gentler management and "playful" workdays.

Young talent isn't as keen on talking with Apple recruiters.

Young talent isn't as keen on talking with Apple recruiters.

Moreover, Apple still doesn't serve free food or offer much in the way of benefits, which is notorious at the very least, and downright shocking for the kind of high-prized, perk-accustomed engineering talent that the company wants to attract. Thus, recruiters claim that Apple is no longer attractive for "top young talent", which now eyes the likes of Facebook, Alphabet, Uber and Airbnb. Ambitious programmers and designers, the kind of employees who sign a contract to dream up the next big thing, are put off by what seems like a "confusing and rigid culture" bearing "a lot of secrecy, a lot of control".

Also, engineers no longer look "to work for Apple", but rather towards "big problems" on the cutting edge of technology, ones that will challenge them creatively and put them at the center. And even though Apple is tackling self-driving car and artificial intelligence projects, it hasn't produced a truly novel product in a while. Its last major release, the Apple Watch, did not become a "must-have" among users, even though it is the best-selling smartwatch right now. Meanwhile, iPhones, iPads, and MacBooks are no longer considered groundbreaking products, just ones undergoing refinement.

Although Apple is the world's largest corporation, more stable than venture-backed companies like Uber and Airbnb, and pays its employees well, it may have to consider relaxing the reins in addition to brainstorming a killer new product. But the latter can't happen without fresh-minded talent, and at present, the iPhone maker seems to be off the radars of disruptive programmers who value flexibility and lifestyle perks over security and a big salary.

Then again, The Guardian's report is only indicative of a trend. For all these recruiters who claim Apple has lost its appeal, there could be just as many claiming the opposite. For all the young coders who'd rather get a job at Uber, there might be just as many who'd give anything to work on the new iPhone. But where there's smoke, there's surely fire. Meanwhile, Apple hasn't reflected upon the publication.

source: The Guardian

Is Apple unable to dream up a killer new product because it no longer attracts young talent?

60 Comments
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posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:29 3

1. TheStanleyFTW (Posts: 238; Member since: 20 Feb 2013)


Yes. :)

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 20:24 1

48. engineer-1701d (Posts: 3208; Member since: 13 Mar 2014)


ha let some f**ker yell in my face as he stated and watch the vps face hit the ground and my foot break his jew.

posted on 02 Feb 2016, 03:02 1

58. JumpinJackROMFlash (Posts: 423; Member since: 10 Dec 2014)


You're probably right about him being a jew. The probability is high.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:35 6

2. SkyfallWalker (Posts: 73; Member since: 28 Jan 2016)


Is it too much for Apple to make iTunes available for Android?

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:44 1

4. xocomaox (Posts: 111; Member since: 14 Dec 2015)


Yes .

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:50 4

9. Wiencon (Posts: 1704; Member since: 06 Aug 2014)


Apple's management is too proud of itself, they will never change

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:54 6

10. LetsBeHonest (Posts: 1293; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)


Apple is not Microsoft nor in the same state(in smartphone of course) lol. Apple is all about me.. me.. me...!!! They make money from selling hardware unlike google who make money through their services(ads:P).. Apple made theirown echo system tied strictly with their hardware. They provide a unique very closed experience. And they don't give a damn abt outsiders:P
"If you don't have iTunes, uhh.. then you don't have am iPhone.. :P"

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:23 1

22. Norris (Posts: 121; Member since: 26 Jun 2015)


Why are you so hateful toward other companies?, and praise apple like there's nothing else..

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:08

30. LetsBeHonest (Posts: 1293; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)


Me? I don't hate any companies.. And I never used any Apple product more than 3 months lol.. Those were extremely closed for me which is not my cup of tea...

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 15:26

43. TechieXP1969 (Posts: 7792; Member since: 25 Sep 2013)


I was using iTunes before I ever bought an iOS based device. I thought it was the best music management app I had seen.

It allowed be to edit the tags and add mu own album art (which other apps can too). It's only downside is it is connected to Apple's servers for content and listing available media and it makes the application slow.

It is the worse malware ever, but I still use it.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 20:28

50. engineer-1701d (Posts: 3208; Member since: 13 Mar 2014)


i had itunes in 2001 or 2 i loved it but it kept crashing my computer so got pissed and battery kept going bad so anyways i still have it somewhere hahaha.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:27 5

23. tedkord (Posts: 9855; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)


Oh God, no. I hate iTunes. It's gummed up both PCs I installed it on. Granted, that was quite a few years ago, and it might have gotten better, but no way I'm installing it on my phone.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 20:24 1

49. engineer-1701d (Posts: 3208; Member since: 13 Mar 2014)


hahahaha thats the only thing stopping masses of people like 60% leaving and going to android or some other. the itunes is on apple.

posted on 02 Feb 2016, 03:03

59. JumpinJackROMFlash (Posts: 423; Member since: 10 Dec 2014)


Why the f*** would you want that crap on Android?

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:37 1

3. Sidewinder (Posts: 392; Member since: 15 Jan 2015)


Hmm.. Well the iPhone was their trump product. But I don't think the iPhone can keep sustaining their revenue. The competition is pretty neck and neck. So unless they try a different approach than just polishing existing features, their future as a sustainable business company is unsure.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:45

5. joey_sfb (Posts: 5229; Member since: 29 Mar 2012)


Well written article.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:47

7. LetsBeHonest (Posts: 1293; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)


Agreed!

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:47 1

6. LetsBeHonest (Posts: 1293; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)


Well its true Apple hasn't dome something truly innovative since a long time. They are kind buy companies with tech and implement it in theirs and name it that they made it. All those tech sites biased towards Apple will claims it as the best and give Apple tons of credits where no name about the originals who made the tech will get mentioned in their articles anywhere.
But Apple surely are the trend setter among developers and OEMs and that gives meaning to Apple's existence more than enough. IPhones are great just like it's competitors but not as great as some (biased) tech journalist exaggerating it to.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 13:35 1

38. Finalflash (Posts: 2712; Member since: 23 Jul 2013)


Problem is that they have actively entrenched their old and dying leadership after jobs died. They sacked Forestall asap and he was the only young exec they had. Ive no longer designs anything decent since Jobs died either. The iPhone 6 looks like crap and the Apple watch is even worse. The battery case is just laughable along with their Pro series trashcan shaped macs and the new MacBook looks like nothing special. They can't come up with something new to save their lives and if they do, they are all set to mess it up.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 14:18

41. marorun (Posts: 2872; Member since: 30 Mar 2015)


Yep So instead they pay ton in marketing and make tech journalist sell the iphone for them.

You know if someone tell you something is the best eventually most ppl will fall for it.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:48 3

8. DRS1977 (Posts: 352; Member since: 27 May 2015)


Apple is a Walmart brand. Anyone can buy an Apple product and just like almost anyone can buy a Toyota Corolla. They are not special or exclusive.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:28

24. tedkord (Posts: 9855; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)


What's that got to do with the article?

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 16:14 2

46. sgodsell (Posts: 3046; Member since: 16 Mar 2013)


Walmart has reasonable prices for everyone. Apple is overpriced in all of their products.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:57 2

11. lyndon420 (Posts: 3706; Member since: 11 Jul 2012)


World's best selling smartwatch? Sales numbers would be nice otherwise I call BS.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:01

19. Tizo101 (Posts: 393; Member since: 05 Jun 2015)


it's only a wonder where he got the numbers from... coz they haven't been released

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:29

25. tedkord (Posts: 9855; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)


I'm sure it is the best individual selling model. But probably not by much, which is why they aren't announcing numbers.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:21

32. ibend (Posts: 3130; Member since: 30 Sep 2014)


Its just common sense among sheeps, lol

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 08:35

53. j2001m (Posts: 2755; Member since: 28 Apr 2014)


It's only China that keep the numbers up

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 07:59

12. Arch_Fiend (Posts: 1930; Member since: 03 Oct 2015)


Apple better get there s**t together.

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 08:38 1

54. j2001m (Posts: 2755; Member since: 28 Apr 2014)


Not going to happen, look what they offered with the pro iPad and said you can now give up your pic, Hahahahahahhahahahahahahah
The best part is many Apple sites like the Verge lost all credibility when they reviewed it and then when you then put there surface reviews next to it, what a joke

It just shows all there iPhone review are crap one way reviews

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 09:56

57. Arch_Fiend (Posts: 1930; Member since: 03 Oct 2015)


The iPhone 6s plus is great just sayin.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:23 1

13. Loubielou (Posts: 496; Member since: 11 Jul 2012)


Apple thing anything they make it will be successful even reguarding the prices the are charging,they do not seem to realise that cost of buying or running there phones its way over the Top,even the Chinese market were Apple struggle to gain buyers,they seem to prefer Budget phones over Apple iPhones the Chinese

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:24 1

14. palmguy (Posts: 489; Member since: 22 Mar 2011)


It's the 80's again! The end is coming!!

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:43 1

15. darkkjedii (Posts: 19353; Member since: 05 Feb 2011)


Trust and believe, they have something coming down the pipe. Apples believes in milking the cow dry. Stay tuned.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:03

20. Tizo101 (Posts: 393; Member since: 05 Jun 2015)


like what though? because I don't see the Apple car being successful.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 11:44

36. darkkjedii (Posts: 19353; Member since: 05 Feb 2011)


Call Tim and ask him. Let us know how the convo goes.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 15:02

42. marorun (Posts: 2872; Member since: 30 Mar 2015)


You got is cellphone number?

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 02:43

52. Tizo101 (Posts: 393; Member since: 05 Jun 2015)


you've got attitude, like a Mitch.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:52 2

16. frustyak (Posts: 205; Member since: 08 Mar 2010)


Maybe Apple can't dream up a killer new product because Steve Jobs is no longer around to do it.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:32

27. tedkord (Posts: 9855; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)


One man can't be responsible for all that. I suspect Steve dreamed up very little, but rather weeded through and picked the best ideas and refined them. Looking at the iPhone 6, I think that is supported. It's by far the best functioning iPhone everever, but also the ugliest design.

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 08:45

55. j2001m (Posts: 2755; Member since: 28 Apr 2014)


Last time I looked there was an I interviewe where bill gates and Steve jobs was being interviewed at the same time just before bill gates gave up or had gave up, not 100% and bill gates gives Steve jobs all the iPad/iPhone ideas, no joke
I.e. They ask bill what will happen in tech or what he thinks will happen, and job rubs is hands

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:56

17. submar (Posts: 282; Member since: 19 Sep 2014)


arrogance

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 08:57

18. Unordinary (Posts: 995; Member since: 04 Nov 2015)


LMAO:

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:39 3

29. willard12 (Posts: 1513; Member since: 04 Jul 2012)


I envy your life. You are in a constant state of laughter.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:21

31. Unordinary (Posts: 995; Member since: 04 Nov 2015)


Hahah

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 12:11 4

37. tedkord (Posts: 9855; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)


So is the Joker...

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:11

21. Tizo101 (Posts: 393; Member since: 05 Jun 2015)


I can only wonder if Apple will be relevant in 10 years. They can still ride the iPhone for decade but will they be like Microsoft (still used but not epic anymore) or like Nokia (not relevant anymore). Nokia used to be huge... everyone had a Nokia and BlackBerry did the same. I hope I don't die because this will be interesting.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 20:57

51. mixedfish (Posts: 1144; Member since: 17 Nov 2013)


If you think about it, 10 yrs ago at around 2006/2007, Nokia was still kicking around as the biggest phone manufacturer. In 10 years time I have no doubts about the game changing once again.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:30

26. jsjammu (Posts: 83; Member since: 13 Nov 2014)


I had predicted their demise in 5 year after the great Steve Jobs is gone. I guess it would a little longer but will happen for sure. It has nothing to do with Apple not hiring younger people. It's just that there was only one Steve Job's and He was the only one who can take an old idea like portable music player and make it what ipod became or take good old computer and make it iMac's of today. It's not what Steve Jobs was selling it's how he was selling. People should really watch the man in the machine Steve Jobs documentary on CNN. You used a lot of phrases that began with imagine what you could do with computer or any product. He also made people think how to imagine the devices are an extension of themselves. Until the next Steve Jobs comes along. Good luck Apple, you are going to need it going forward.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 09:37 1

28. cncrim (Posts: 789; Member since: 15 Aug 2011)


Without out Job they lost thier touch. However they still gave great team at apple

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:23 5

33. ibend (Posts: 3130; Member since: 30 Sep 2014)


step 1 : fire Cook
step 2 : fire Ive
and start from there...

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:57

34. cnour (Posts: 542; Member since: 11 Sep 2014)


iPhone and iPad is not enough in 10 years!!!!

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 15:46

45. TechieXP1969 (Posts: 7792; Member since: 25 Sep 2013)


5 more.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 10:58

35. Mfa901 (Posts: 247; Member since: 14 Jul 2012)


next big step will be 'IOS Open Source Project'
one team of IOS don't stand anywhere around android community....
this community feeds android with sh** load of ideas and suggestions...
everyone can see how android have evolved and how ios is still almost same

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 13:53

39. alumoyo (Posts: 344; Member since: 26 Aug 2013)


Well from what I've read, Tim Cooks culture is A LOT friendlier that Job's style ever was. So maybe the ones complaining are just mediocre performers who could never hack it and come up with the next big thing anyway. I mean seriously - you can't have much ambition when you work for one of the most important tech companies in the world and one of your biggest concerns is A FREE LUNCH! All the real talent launch their own startups anyway. Those people going to Alphabet, Facebook etc. WHAT GREAT THINGS HAVE THEY DONE OVER THERE LATELY??? Apple has buckets of money, so if they see what they feel is the next big thing being done by a small startup, all they have to do is but the startup - PROBLEM SOLVED.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 14:11 1

40. kryme (Posts: 326; Member since: 24 Oct 2013)


Google AI... Phones and tablet is not everything that Google does

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 15:45 1

44. TechieXP1969 (Posts: 7792; Member since: 25 Sep 2013)


This to me is a touch one on so many levels.
A company full of old farts, even if they had young talent, still may not come up with a good idea. Because old people are set in their ways, and will just think the youing person is crazy.

Microsoft for example did get somewhat young talent in that Belfore guy. But Windows phone at first which looked good, still had Windows Mobile underneath because the old people just didnt want to give it up.

Young talent made the Windows 8 UI, but old farts didn't like in, inside and outside of Microsoft.

Apple has brought to the tablet ideas and concepts that manufacturing capabilities woudl have made expensive years ago. If today's smartphone, tablet and similar devices were released in year 2000 when Bill Gates spoke of them, they would have costed 3 times or more.

After 2007, this wasn't an issue.

However what technology could we really move to next? What is the next big iPad? The next big idea can come from even an old fart. All we need is a person who can take 2 things from today's tech and spin it off into something new.

The Surface has potential of spinning off a Windows PC into a modern tablet form factor and I think it is the start of a new idea and concept that could be taken a step further. Surface-Phone be it. They already have a phone that can run desktop-like apps on a screen, which Moto tried and failed and MS did better because Windows is more usable.

But right now, there isn't an available product where we could combine them and create a nice revolution. You know and old fart took the concept of a phone, a printer and a fax and made a modern unit that houses all 3. Intel has found a way to shove a full PC into a little box you can plug into any TV and make it a PC. Google has shoved streaming services into a small dongle.Android was inspired by a group of young people who had talent.

Apple is goign to have a hard time beating their own iPhone without "borrowing" some ideas from someone. Example the Surface. Apple has mocked it, yet they released the ipad pro which tries to mimic it albeit very poorly when they could have just made it run OSX and made it x86. They missed a shot yet again.

When the first iPad was rumor, people were making concepts of an iPad running OSX. Apple is stupid for not doing that first and allowing YET AGAIN, for a rival to beat them to the punch.

Apple should have had the first big smartphone. It's evolution. The iPad should have been running OSX as soon as Intel made the ATOM.

Old people can't improvise. If Ballmer was younger, he would have seen the iPhone as a threat and tried to shoot for better with a real Windows Phone. Instead his old fart butt laugh first and Apple got the last laugh. Now who is in 2rd place when they probably could have been 2nd?

Talent has nothing to do with age, it has to do with inspiration, and the balls to do what others won't or might..but do it sooner vs later. Timing is everything.

posted on 29 Jan 2016, 18:36 1

47. Baracus (Posts: 223; Member since: 15 Sep 2012)


Apple hasn't innovated in years and now they're more about just polishing up the same IOS and the only talent they care about is in their legal department.

posted on 30 Jan 2016, 09:55 2

56. TechieXP1969 (Posts: 7792; Member since: 25 Sep 2013)


You don't need talented lawyers when you have Judge Koh.

posted on 02 Feb 2016, 03:08

60. JumpinJackROMFlash (Posts: 423; Member since: 10 Dec 2014)


And they also don't need talented lawyers when they have the Apple money behind them. They can crush anyone with drawn out legal processes just from the cost.

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