ARM says it can do business with Huawei after all

ARM says it can do business with Huawei after all
When Huawei was placed on the U.S. Commerce Department's Entity list in the middle of May, it meant that the Chinese manufacturer no longer had access to its U.S. supply chain. Right away companies like Google and Qualcomm announced that they were cutting ties with Huawei. Also announcing that it was no longer dealing with Huawei was the U.K.'s ARM Holdings. ARM's processor architecture is licensed to chipmakers around the world and its Cortex-Axx CPU cores are used in chipsets like Qualcomm's Snapdragon line and in Apple's Ax SoCs.

So you might be questioning why ARM felt that it had to comply with the U.S. Commerce Department's entity list. The company pointed out back in May that its designs contain "US original technology." And this could have been deadly to Huawei because its HiSilicon unit designs the Kirin chipsets used in its phones. These chips are manufactured by TSMC and the recently announced Kirin 990 uses ARM's Cortex-A76 and ARM's Cortex-A55 CPU cores. Huawei's fear was that its upcoming phones wouldn't be covered by a previously signed licensing agreement made with ARM, forcing it to search for a replacement design.

But this is no longer a fear for Huawei thanks to ARM's realization that its technology comes from the U.K., not the U.S. According to Reuters, this means that ARM will continue to do business with the Chinese manufacturer without violating the U.S. supply chain ban. An ARM spokesman sent an email to Reuters today stating that "ARM’s v8 and v9 are UK-origin technologies."

Huawei shipped 200 million phones 64 days faster than it did last year

Huawei had a goal of shipping 300 million handsets this year and surpassing Samsung to become the largest smartphone manufacturer in the world. It shipped 59 million handsets in each of the first two-quarters thanks to strong domestic sales, and on October 22nd it hit 200 million units shipped in record time. Last year, when the outfit delivered 206 million phones for all of 2018, it didn't reach this milestone until December 25th which was 64 days later than this year.

While international sales of its latest flagship phones, the Mate 30 and Mate 30 Pro, might have suffered from the lack of Google's core apps like the Play Store, Maps, Gmail, YouTube, and Search, domestically Huawei is beating up on rivals. During the second quarter of this year, Huawei's shipments in China rose 31% year-over-year and it's market share soared from 27.6% to 38.2% over the same time period. Oppo, which finished behind Huawei during the three months, had a market share of 18.3%. During that period, Huawei was offering its camera-centric P30 models which did come with the Google Play services version of Android pre-installed.

If you don't follow the news and are wondering how Huawei ended up here, it's because the company has long been considered a national security threat in the U.S. That's because the laws in China permit the communist government to demand that the company gather intelligence on corporations and consumers in other countries. This has led lawmakers in the states to wonder whether Huawei's phones and networking equipment contain backdoors that send collected information to servers in Beijing. While Huawei has repeatedly denied these allegations, it did get indicted on 13 counts earlier this year by the U.S. Justice Department. Huawei, two of its affiliates (Huawei Device USA and Skycom Tech), and CFO Meng Wanzhou were charged with doing business in Iran and committing bank fraud to cover it up. Iran is under economic sanctions in the U.S.

There has been talk on the part of President Donald Trump about using Huawei's Entity List placement as a bargaining chip in future trade negotiations between the U.S. and China; both countries are embroiled in a huge Trade War. Even though recent talks between the two countries didn't mention Huawei at all, the chief of Huawei's consumer group, Richard Yu, has said that he believes that the U.S. will indeed use the company to get better terms from China in a trade deal.



1. Whitedot

Posts: 857; Member since: Sep 26, 2017

What took them so long to realise they are UK company in this fortunate respect?

4. raky_b

Posts: 420; Member since: Jul 02, 2014

Just wait, it would not be surprise if Google soon find out that it is actually Cayman based company instead US.

7. Cat97

Posts: 1969; Member since: Mar 02, 2017

Obedience to Trump.

2. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

Crazy that it took ARM this long to realize this, but good news for Huawei nonetheless. The U.S. government needs to either list actual proof of Huawei doing wrong and spying and having backdoors in its equipment (which they won’t because the U.S. government has no proof), or cut this BS political propaganda tomfoolery out. When the government can’t even supply proof of Huawei being guilty to companies like Microsoft when they ask for it, you know the fix is in.

5. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

I'm reading this argument long time and I think it's just a lot of blah blah. If the Chinese government can force by law Chinese brands to gather intelligence on their behalf, then the USA government (and any other government for that matter) doesn't need to prove whether Huawei has any spyware included now in their equipment. They can already ban the company -and any other Chinese company they deem dangerous- as a preventive measurement. Clearly the reason why Huawei is singled out is because its not just strong in the smartphone market but because of their telecommunications equipment business.

6. splus

Posts: 166; Member since: Nov 26, 2011

The US government can do the same - force any of its companies to provide them any data. And so can any other government. Your argument doesn't stand.

8. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

It stands, because in US and most other nations this is not the law. It would need the judiciary system to be involved in the request and on separate cases each time. Let's not forget that China also doesn't permit Google services within their territory and already long ago. The question is not whether the US government is right or not to ban Huawei, but the fact that it doesn't have to prove anything for banning Huawei. If the notion that the US government has to provide proof is so widespread here, then at the same vein the Chinese government should also provide proof as to why they consider Google services dangerous inside their their realm.

9. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

Feanor: How you feel about the argument is absolutely inconsequential to me, and every bit of “blah blah blah” that you claim my argument is. The U.S. government can force any company in North America it wants to do the same thing on its behalf. Whether it’s the law or not means nothing to a country like the U.S. that breaks laws constantly. Proof needs to be shown or the U.S. is no better than any other dictator/communist country it tries so hard not to be. They also need to show proof because their actions have a direct negative impact on American companies...they stand to lose 11 billion annually due to the ban. Huawei was singled out as bargaining chip to be used in the trade war, and nothing more. If Huawei posed the threat that it did, NO other country would be using its technology, whether it was smartphones or networking equipment.

10. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

You do understand though the hypocrisy of accusing the US government for banning Huawei after so many years of China banning Google services without any more proof of wrongdoing, right?

11. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

You do understand the hypocrisy of supporting the U.S. ban as if the U.S. has not banned other goods and services from other countries without any proof, right?

12. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

“China says it has no rule that forces its tech companies to install backdoors or other security flaws in their products, and Chinese and Western legal experts say Chinese government data-sharing requirements, though broad, apply only to networks inside China.” Chinese law also states that it can only force information from telecoms, and only force information from network providers about information in its own country, not abroad. Whether the U.S. believes this or not is inconsequential, as according to this, there is no law in China that states Huawei HAS to provide information on anything OUTSIDE OF China. I got this information, including the what’s quoted, from here:

13. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

Last comment from me, because there's no reason to repeat. I never said I support the ban of Huawei by the US government, so I'm not the hypocrite. The hypocrisy is only from those that complain about the ban on Huawei from the US, turning a blind eye to the fact that China is the one that started the whole thing with banning foreign companies from operating within China; whereas Chinese companies have been allowed up to this point to operate unobstructed outside of China. I will once more remind you of the banning of Google services, WhatsApp, Facebook, as well as the prohibition of foreign car manufacturers to sell cars in China, unless they form join-ventures with Chinese car manufacturers in order to pass on know-how and subsequently be forced to limit their competitive advantage. China has been violating the international laws of free market for decades and now they get all touchy when they taste a bit of their own medicine. About the second topic I don't even need to discuss. This is not a chat forum to discuss politics and compare which regime in the world takes the sceptre of oppression.

14. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

You clearly support the ban, or you wouldn’t be here defending the U.S. government’s actions. So yeah, you are the hypocrite. No one is turning a blind eye on what China has done, and if you actually took the time to read my comments, you’ll see that my comments are in support of Huawei ONLY. Too many of the people here that think like you do keep thinking support of Huawei means support of the Chinese government, and you’re absolutely wrong for thinking that way. I will also once more remind you that the U.S. government has banned foreign services as well, and they ban foreign companies like Huawei over SPECULATION, and not cold, hard FACTS. The U.S. government has violated so many laws that I can no longer keep up, as well as having BOMBED their own, like when they bombed Puerto Rico TWICE. Police in the U.S. have also bombed an area in Philadelphia where people lived, with no repercussions from the government, which actually supported the action. If you didn’t feel this was the place to discuss politics, you wouldn’t have responded to my initial comment with politics.

17. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

Feanor: What happened to “last comment”? There is a reason why so many countries are choosing NOT to ban Huawei...NO PROOF of wrongdoing, just speculating and equating based on the fact that Huawei is a Chinese company. Speculation isn’t wrongdoing. All your link does is show what China has done, not Huawei, while other countries have inspected Huawei’s equipment and found nothing that points to spying, backdoors, etc.

19. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

What I posted is from a specialist whose word you will allow me to take more into consideration than yours. Also I'm still waiting for you to give me a correct example of a brand that the US banned and I haven't received any. For your other topic, about others NOT having found Huawei guilty, recently I read an article that the German government permitted the usage of Huawei equipment under extensive pressure from the local network providers, who claimed that without equipment from Huawei they will not be able to enter the 5G market soon enough and their profits will be irreparably hurt. The reason why Huawei has a competitive advantage over other equipment providers is again linked to the anticompetitive strategies of the Chinese government, by securing Huawei with enough cash flow to crash the competition. Unlike the US government, who clearly doesn't care about how the Huawei ban will hurt the profits of American companies, Germany seems to care. But this doesn't say anything about whether Huawei poses a risk or not.

20. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

So much for “last comment” from you, huh? Lmao! What you posted is from someone that has provided NO PROOF that Huawei is spying. You keep equating Huawei to China, and that’s false. I’m also waiting for you to provide PROOF of Huawei spying on behalf of the Chinese government, of which you have provided NONE. Yet, this very article is proof enough of the U.S. government banning a brand, a small while having NO PROOF of wrongdoing. Germany chose to use Huawei’s products because Huawei isn’t guilty of spying. Do you really think the German government would allow telecoms would use equipment that has backdoors in it from a foreign country? Absolutely not. “In March, Chancellor Angela Merkel said that she won’t ban a company “simply because it’s from a certain country,” in apparent hint on the situation around Huawei.” That’s a quote from the article I linked. Huawei has a competitive advantage because they have put in the work, done the research, and innovated in their areas of expertise. And the U.S. government is ready to throw heaps of cash at both U.S. and foreign companies in an effort to stifle Huawei in regards to 5G networking tech, so I you need to rethink believing that the U.S. government wouldn’t help others have a “competitive advantage”. NO countries government would agree to use a foreign companies technology if it was PROVEN that they were spying.

21. Feanor

Posts: 1410; Member since: Jun 20, 2012

Ok, now your comments get a bit dumb; I don't need to provide with any proof of Huawei spying, because I agree with you that there is NO PROOF that Huawei spies. You just don't get it. My point is: 1. The US doesn't need to bring forth any proof of Huawei spying, as China has similarly not come with any proof about Google spying. 2. US responds to anticompetitive practises of China. On the contrary I do believe that the EU is too liberal and I think they should protect themselves more from the Chinese expansionism. Actually they should fend themselves from the US as well, but to a lesser extend. Got it? I never said that I am sure that Huawei spies. Thank you.

22. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

You always know when someone has weak comprehension skills when they have to start calling things dumb that they don’t understand, lol. If you agreed with me, you wouldn’t be here defending the U.S. government as much as you are. YOU just don’t get it: 1. The U.S. government NEEDS to bring forth proof of Huawei spying, as the ban on Huawei ALONE will negatively impact U.S. companies to the tune of 11 billion annually. That’s not chump change, by any stretch of the imagination. There are companies that lobby heavily for certain interest in the U.S., and we all know that it’s the corporations that really run this country. Without any proof, the U.S. looks like any other dictator/communist country that they are so desperately trying to be different from. It’s only a matter of time before the business that stand to lose the most put too much pressure on the government to either provide tangible evidence or drop the ruse. 2. The U.S. just doesn’t want a foreign power to be so far ahead of it in terms of technology. Other countries see this, which is why they choose not to ban Huawei in the face of NO EVIDENCE of wrongdoing. Open your eyes and stop defending the U.S. and believing what they are spoon feeding you. Got it? I hope so. You’re welcome.

15. Venom

Posts: 3778; Member since: Dec 14, 2017

I agree Feanor. That's the biggest proof right there and so far the Huawei apologists have yet to give a legit reason to think otherwise.

18. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

That’s not “proof” of Huawei doing anything wrong, that’s speculation. It’s also equating Huawei to China, which is incorrect. The Huawei haters seem to not know the difference between these things, as I already have said.

23. Venom

Posts: 3778; Member since: Dec 14, 2017

China has pumped dollars into Huawei to stifle competition for the 5G market. China has banned multiple companies from doing business in their country unless they pretty much give up their IP and join with other companies while China is free to operate outside of their own country. How is it fair for China to stifle competition but the US is in the wrong? You once again miss the point in that the Chinese government has the law to where they can go in and request Huawei to spy on other countries. What you once again fail to understand is that China has banned entities from their country multiple times over the years yet you and several others still think that the US is wrong for doing the same thing. That's in addition to the other things Huawei was guilty of that another user posted in a previous article.

24. meanestgenius

Posts: 22388; Member since: May 28, 2014

There is absolutely no proof that China has pumped dollars into Huawei with the intention of “stifling the competition”. Using that logic, Canada has pumped dollars into BlackBerry with the intention of “stifling the competition ”, and that is not the case. The U.S., however, has banned Huawei with the exact intention of stifling them while they go out to pump dollars into the competition, even to the extent of doing so for foreign companies. The U.S. has banned companies as well, most notably Huawei, and all with no proof of wrongdoing. I NEVER once claimed that it’s fair for China to do anything wrong. My arguments have been SOLELY in the defense of Huawei ONLY. But as I said, you Huawei haters just can’t seem to grasp that Huawei and China are not the same entity. You once again are blind to the fact that there is NO LAW that states that China can force Huawei or any other company to spy on companies OUTSIDE of China. I posted such evidence in my comment #12. Huawei therefore by law DOES NOT have to comply with any request from the Chinese government to spy on a foreign country OUTSIDE of China, but once again, you fail to make the distinction between China and Huawei. I challenge you or anyone here to post proof that I am supporting China as opposed to defending Huawei from an unfair ban that is rife with BS political propaganda, I also challenge to PROOF of Huawei spying on behalf of the Chinese government, as opposed to thinking allegations are a form of proof. Meanwhile, U.S. companies like Google, Cisco and others have been PROVEN to have backdoors and to spy on behalf of the U.S. government, and you wholeheartedly support that. Before you ask me how is anything fair, you should first ask yourself how is it fair for you to support one that does exactly what bash China for doing.

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