HTC to Apple on patents: "We have to sit down and figure it out"
Now the Taiwanese want to seriously talk it out and move along with life, as per Winston Yung, HTC's Chief Financial Officer: “We have to sit down and figure it out. We’re open to having discussions. We are open to all sorts of solutions, as long as the solution and the terms are fair and reasonable. On and off we’ve had discussions with Apple, even before the initial determination came out.”
HTC is already paying royalties to Microsoft for their mobile patents, to the tune of $5 per each Android handset it makes, and it might now have to throw some cash the Apple way too, unless these two tit-for-tat violations mutually destruct in court. If HTC has to pay, we don't know if this will be significant enough to affect HTC's handset prices in some way, or the difference will be negligible enough for the Taiwanese to absorb in their profit margin.
1. kamen (Posts: 87; Member since: 18 Jul 2011)
Nicely played, HTC, with the aquisition of S3 :)
2. PhoneLuver (Posts: 480; Member since: 05 Jul 2010)
If only Google would do the same! If Google doesn't do anything to protect manufacturers from lawsuits, and Microsoft, Apple, plus various patent trolls manage to increase the cost of production, manufacturers will reduce and in some cases even stop producing Android handsets should an alternative present itself like WebOS or even Meego.
Android is big, but as Nokia has shown us, nobody is too big to fail!
29. theBnakRobber (unregistered)
Google is already in talks to buy another patent company that has over 8,000 patents a lot relating to mobile and data patents. With that said I think Apple raised the price of the Nortel patents to make them all show the fear they have for Google and join together to keep Google from getting it, while all along they were in talks to buy another patent company with double amount of patents. That's a good way to make others pay more money while they were talking with another company on the down low. Google played their hands very well.
30. theBankRobber (unregistered)
Sorry ment Google raised the price on Apple to make the bid more money and show their fear of Google. It only makes sense. If they want it more the Google, make them pay a higher price.
4. SuperAndroidEvo (Posts: 4751; Member since: 15 Apr 2011)
Yes other manufacturers are wizening up & are starting to protect themselves from Apple. Apple is blatantly taking everyone to court & the top competition to Apple, like HTC & Samsung are going to protect themselves. This looks like it's going to be a wash & HTC will be able to sell their phones in the United States of America. See Apple two can play at this game!
3. Reply (unregistered)
HTC to Apple on patents: "We have to sit down and figure it out"
15. Heatfan316 (unregistered)
74. Guest (unregistered)
no you shut up! :)
5. snowgator (Posts: 3462; Member since: 19 Jan 2011)
No words how annoying the term "patent infringement" is getting. Settle this thing. It is easy to see HTC violated Apple's patents, and pretty clear Apple was violating someone elses. HTC was smart enough to cover itself. So, HTC can set the bar on how to handle Apple. I have no idea if pending lawsuits with Samsung and Motorola are for the same patents, but since Apple will not be able to really get anybody banned from the US market, this will help end all the other crap as well.
7. dandirk (unregistered)
Google really should be trying to work around the patents. I know apple will.
Patents are pretty messed up, especially for technology. They have to be detailed, then its easy to work around them, but if they are to vague they can lock down whole segments of features/markets.
Would really like to read the patents Applie is accused of infringing on. I know the ones which apple owns are pretty vague, one pretty much covers a single chip that can communicate to multiple types of methods (think multi-function modem). It was pretty complex so I could be off on that. But reading the patent was vague and confusing all at the same time.
The other had to do with creating links on the fly to other subsystems of the phone... aka phone #s open the dialer, address navigation etc... The patent pretty much said it had a server and client component (these can be on same device so don't confuse with internet "server" which scans on screen content and creates links base on "common data" aka phone #, address etc.
The second could possibly be worked around, personally the idea of patenting a essentially a hyperlink to do obvious stuff like dial a # is not really a patent, but all the great inventions are the simple obvious ones (like paper clip).
Also I am confused why dynamic links on site (for ads) doesn't also infringe... maybe it isn't because its not specifically in the patent.
Don't be fooled, just cause a company has a patent doesn't mean they invented it... companies buy patents all the time. All companies do this, to lock down their market or to use the tech royalty free. I think this is just in the news more due to Apple/Android rivalry.
8. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
well hopefully this is the end of the HTC lawsuits. Well played by them... lol
21. iwebdroidberry7 (Posts: 230; Member since: 17 Jan 2011)
What happened to the giant Google protecting HTC and stopping Apples reign of tyranny.
40. E.N. (Posts: 2577; Member since: 25 Jan 2009)
I'm wondering the same thing. Probably all talk
52. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
nothing happens fast in the world of layers and courts.
who knows, maybe google had some influence in this decision.
10. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Not sure how the trolls are seeing this as a victory for HTC. HTC said they want to work it out which is usually done by the weaker of the two. Also you're all very hypocritical because you're only upset when Apple sues. Where's the outrage at all the other lawsuits including against Apple.
Sniggly I read your little pity party you threw yourself in the other thread. My response is that you should grow a pair and act like a man.
11. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
Or it could be because HTC holds patents that Apple is infringing on and vice versa. Working it out without the courts is always a better answer than sue sue sue sue suuuuuuuuue everyone.
Why would someone be outraged that someone is suing apple now? If apple was a quiet company that didnt sue every one, then they would be outraged. As it is, noone gets mad when the school yard bully get's whats been comming to him.
12. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
Okay. Since you obviously lack empathy for anyone who's had it tougher than you in your cream puff world, and you refuse to agree to a truce, fine. I'll be emailing Phonearena by tonight.
It's too bad, really. I hoped you would grow up and start acting like a human f**king being, but you can't even handle that.
13. ngo2dd (Posts: 896; Member since: 08 Jul 2011)
Do you have anything better to do then talk s**t about people? You know have is infringing on S3 patient right? This is also a PR move where it is showing HTC is willing to work out a solution, if Apple don't accept it will look back on their part and the public will see that they don't want monopoly.
14. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
One more thing, Taco: you don't deserve a single thing you have. How do I know? Because you clearly haven't earned a single thing you have. People who've never had to work for anything they have are the quickest to look down on and jeer at those who have not, because in their perspective, it was so easy for them that everyone should be at their level. So if anyone isn't sharing their ivory tower, then there's clearly something fundamentally wrong with that person.
It's obvious that this is how you think. Good luck to you when the trust fund runs out.
18. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
You're so full of sh*** it's not even funny. You come on here and twist facts around and insult people who use Apple by calling them "disgusting" and freak out if anyone comes back at you. It's laughable that you would write PA that I called you "poor". Go right ahead if you think anyone would care. It just makes you look like a punk who can't stand up for himself. People can call me whatever they want on the internet.
You're not even 10% of what you think you are sniggly. Keep trolling and I'll keep calling you out. Once you stop being a hypocrite and insulting Apple users I'll respond in kind.
23. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
That's right, Taco. Keep talking s**t. You'll notice that virtually everyone on this website hates you now, and for good reason.
You have no basis to be playing the victim here. You're a bully and a thug, which you just admitted below. Clearly the kind of -man- sorry, BOY who thinks with his fists instead of his mind.
I do almost pity you, Taco. What's it like to not be loved, to be despised by everyone? What do you want your epitaph to read when you die alone?
24. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Yes I'm sure you know what my personal life is like. You brought up the fact you'd punch me in the face not me. You're a hypcocrite as usual. I have plenty of love and success in my life. You're the one that throws pity parties for yourself and your failure of a life.
25. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
Please. No one who has any happiness would be as bitter as you clearly are.
I "threw my sob story" to illustrate that my experiences have taught me not to look down on those who have less than me, unlikeyou. You've never had to sacrifice or work for anything you have in your supposedly perfect little life. And so it's unsurprising that you lack even a fundamental level of empathy. I called you out and wanted to hit you because of what you were saying to other people on here, not to me.
You're nothing, Taco. Hated by all and hating yourself. You will die lonely, broken and forgotten if you continue down this path, because everyone who gets close enough to you will see how completely ugly you are.
Have fun with that. How's your trust fund?
31. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
But you look down on Apple users because of their phone choice and call them disgusting and sheep. That makes sense.
45. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
It doesn't make sense because I don't express nor hold such opinions, Taco. What does it feel like to be a compulsive liar, Taco? To know that people feel they can't trust a single syllable that escapes your lips?
How does it feel to be all alone? Even Gemini isn't giving any comments of support to you. How does it feel to be abandoned and helpless against the onslaught of truth, which is that you're despised because you're simply an asshole, and not because of some quasi religious conspiracy?
50. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
So you haven't said Apple users are disgusting? Should I pull it up and prove you're a liar once again? Did you not say you would punch me in the face if we were in person?
You're comments are saved on the internet so lying is pointless you spineless troll.
56. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
I said it was disgusting seeing people in the Apple store buying Apple products without even comparison shopping or considering anything else. This was something I already clarified with davecann2.
And yes, I said that if you had made those disgusting jeers at people for not having enough money in my presence, after this long dealing with your horses**t, I would have finally lost my patience and punched you in the face.
Does it suck being this bad at reading comprehension? Does it hurt not doing well in school because you couldn't comprehend the material? I mean, you obviously took your anger out on the world by beating other people up, which you admitted elsewhere.
It's clear you're starved for attention; otherwise, why be so hostile to everyone without reason? So you get attention the only way you know how: by being a brat. But you know all of this; why do I have to tell you?
57. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Exactly you're a hypocrite. You said people in Apple stores are disgusting for not comparison shopping you then later said you'd get a Motorola tablet regardless because your loyal to their brand. Then you said you'd punch me in the face and you call me a bully and thug. This despite the fact you bash Apple and it's customers constantly and me never threatening anyone on here while you have both physically and by threatening to report people.
Then you continue to make conclusions about me and insult me while at the same time being outraged when it's done to others. Face you're a spineless troll who thinks really highly of themselves despite having no accomplishments to base it on.
60. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
No, no no no no.. you don't get to judge me. Lol, you wouldn't be in a position to judge anyone. It's obvious the conclusions are true, otherwise you wouldn't be so defensive and hostile now.
You brought this upon yourself. Just like all of your problems, of course. You're a bully and a thug who thinks positively of beating up on people you don't like. You're lonelyband starved for attention, yet you don't realize that by your actions you're destroying any chance of ever having even the most casual of acquaintances.
19. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Oh just saw the comment where you said you'd "punch me in the face". You're the same person that I used to beat up when I was a kid. I'm not an internet tough guy and I don't threaten people, but you'd definitely get crushed. You know nothing about me.
22. ngo2dd (Posts: 896; Member since: 08 Jul 2011)
You are the one to talk you are the biggest troll here. You believe that Apple came up with so many 'new' thing. In of your other post you said that Android copy iOS folder system when we all know that the folder system was added on to iOS 4.0 with the release of the iphone 4 and android had it since 1.0 and the fact that sybiam had it long before then too. Now who is just making up s**t?
33. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
so wait.. taco is
1) an adult
2) supposedly rich
3) a big strong guy
4) tony starke?
seriously.. taco taco taco.. we dont care that your 50 and live with your parents.. or 12 and having trouble with your prepubescent emotions.. its ok.. we understand (thats about the only 2 stories I'd believe from him)
If we had to keep one or the other.. ANYONE or you .. i'd choose anyone.. especially sniggly who posts more facts, does more thinking, and is generally pretty polite until riled up by some internet idiots... than you. I'm pretty sure 97% of the site (other than miz and gemini of course) would agree.
You and obama share something right now. He is consistantly losing mock elections to "any republican" and you would lose a "who should stay" vote to "any member".
42. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Of course you agree with sniggly you're both android trolls who are blind to reality. Not sure what Obama has to do with anything.
Fact is even in this thread you've shown to completely lack any logic by suggesting Google stop doing business with Apple even though they make millions together. No one in their right mind would do that. That's why you're an internet troll and not doing anything of importance.
53. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
And what are you doing with your life exactly?
Achieving your goal of being the most disliked person on an internet board?
CONGRATULATIONS!!! YOU WIN!!
And It has nothing to do with sniggly and I agreeing a lot.
It has everything to do with knowledge, respect, research, proof of the things he says, and just general likability..
all things which you lack in abundance
58. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
You and sniggly make stuff up all the time most of the things you say are based on nothing or flawed arguments.
16. snowgator (Posts: 3462; Member since: 19 Jan 2011)
Love the "all of you" comment. I agreed with Apple on the App Store suit against Amazon. I posted early on that Apple might have a legit case against Samsung. Several posters hate Apple suing, but have said they have a right to protect themselves, just not ban a company. I even posted that I had seen you just state your opinion and people jump on you and insulting you and I thought it was crap. Comes a point, Mr Taco, where you paint everyone with a broad brush, you become ideological blind. To waste that much vile on PHONES is just unreal. I do feel bad for the amount of distaste you have for any opinion that isn't yours. Takes a lot of energy to stay that mad for that long. It is plain flat obvious you want people mad at you so you can fight. Wonder if there were more Apple supporters than Android fans if you would just go blog somewhere else to pick fights. This is supposed to be enjoyable. Sad part is, you are intelligent. Just bigoted. What a waste.
17. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
I'm referring to the trolls so if you're not trolling I'm not referring to you
20. duder (unregistered)
wow taco get angry much oh and id pepsi challenge that you could take sniggly or anyone on this site for that matter
26. NeXoS (Posts: 286; Member since: 03 May 2011)
Apple is copying Android's "Voice Actions," did Google patent that?
Google should patent every new feature it puts into Android from now on.
28. Sniggly (Posts: 7296; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
Agreed. They should apply for a patent on the notification tray. HTC Sense should also patent the enhanced lock screen and sue the f**k out of apple for copying that.
49. iwebdroidberry7 (Posts: 230; Member since: 17 Jan 2011)
Android created voice actions? The iPhone has had them as far as I can remember, they just sucked.
62. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Facts are meaningless to this guy as long as Apple is "losing".
65. ngo2dd (Posts: 896; Member since: 08 Jul 2011)
when was it introduce? in iOS 4? in iOS 3? in iOS 2? in iOS 1?
71. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
The 3GS had it in 2009 which was iOS 3.0 I believe. I don't think android had them yet.
27. NeXoS (Posts: 286; Member since: 03 May 2011)
Google, here's a ballsy play for ya:
Pull all your apps off the iPhone and iPad. No Google maps, no Gmail, no Google search.
Let those iPhone users have Bing and Hotmail. Mobile users don't use search engines much anyway, like less than 10% compared to desktop users.
32. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Google makes money off advertising not android sales. It wouldn't make any business since to pull google products of iPhone since they make a bunch of money off of it. They're not blinded by hate.
34. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
while on the general it doesnt make any sense because they do make money off adds... if apple keeps messing with android's main partners, i would definately concider it if i were google's top guy.
Many of apples most use apps come from google.
U keep suing my guys, and ill piss off all of your customers while u get to explain why I pulled the apps.
35. gallitoking (Posts: 4717; Member since: 17 May 2011)
you guys are emotional and that si a worng way of doing business. google and apple are cell phone competitors... but not archirivals.... this is not gotham city... they exist to make money...
37. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
the only reason I think it would have any merrit is for the simple fact that apple is going after androids main suppliers.
What would happen if HTC and Samsung said they had enough of Apple's frivilous lawsuits and quit making android phones? Even worse.. what would happen if apple actually WON one of those lawsuits and got their phones banned from the US?
Pulling google services like search, maps, voice, map integration with thousands of apps, ect off the iphone would be quick reminder that apple needs google just like google needs apple.. When all of a sudden you have 100 million iphone users screaming murder because google was replaced with bing or something else, u might rethink your strategies a bit.
43. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
totally illogical argument by you again remix. Google isn't run by fandroid trolls.
44. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)
@remix. Your post made no sense at all.
Apple wilk go after anyone that has infringed on their protected IP's. Just so happened that android is the king of them all. So naturally, Apple will go after android OEM's.
Google could not pull their services from Apple devices. Their services are publicly open. They can get in serious trouble if they refuse their services to a selected group. It's either you're open, or you're exclusive/closed. Just like Apple could get in serious trouble if they would stop google and kindle and amazon services into their devices, unless they can prove that there's a conflict of interest.
54. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
no.. you know your an ignoramus.. so i dont need to point that out this time...
your first paragraph has no merrit.
Your second paragraph is completely senseless. Apple has final say on ALL apps on the app store. They can pull anyone for any reason. It is Apples closed system and they are "god" there. They dont have to prove crap. Its in their developer's agreement.
Google makes app for the app store. All they have to do is quit supplying the apps to the store and change the coding so other apps cant link with them (like apps with built in google maps services).
The arent required to supply anything to Apple through the app store. They are just another developer there.
Does it make financial sense? HELL NO.. except.. and only in the exception if apple gets close to getting android phones banned from the market. That is a direct hit to google and their revenue streams.
You forget, if HTC and Samsung cant sell their big android phones, Google also takes a hit from lack of advertising sales. Google has a vested interest to make sure Apple either doesnt win, or is forced to back off.
The "pull google apps from the appstore" argument is a fail safe.. a last resort... not something you would do normally.
59. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
As opposed to your strategy of losing millions of dollars to teach Apple a lesson. * rolls eyes*
75. taco5O (unregistered)
I like the word troll and I use it all the time. It was the word on my word a day toilet paper roll.
36. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)
My GUESS is, Htc will end up paying Apple some amount. Initially, it would've been a bigger amount, but since Apple was also found guilty on infringing two of Htc bought patents (of lesser value I believe), Apple would have to settle for a lower amount. And then Apple will go after the others.
We have to understand that Apple, being late in the phone business, is spending considerable amount of money on paying for licensing fees to other companies (like Nokia), who have been around for many years, and have tons and tons of patented IP's in their arsenal. Apple would have to depend on their new ideas & innovations, patent it, and store it in their own treasury of patents, so they could also charge the others licensing fees to offset their licensing fees expenses. A company can profit in licensing fees. Ask Nokia, HP and Microsoft. I think they're the top earners in collecting lincesing fees. So what's wrong if Apple wants some of their money back?
38. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
nothing wrong with protecting IP. Something wrong with suing because your losing market share. These arent "new" infringements that just happened. Apple only cares now because samsung and HTC are android's 2 biggest suppliers.
39. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)
Apple is not suing because they're losing market share. There is no case for that. You can't sue anyone just because they're gaining market share, can you?
What would you like to happen then? That Apple should just pay Nokia, Microsoft, and the others licensing fees for every iphone, ipod touch, and ipad that they sell? And they should just sit and watch and let the others use their ideas that they have patented, for free? What's the use of protecting your IP's then if you would just sit their and let the others rip you off? I guess you find it alright for everyone to charge Apple licensing fees, but it's not alright when Apple asks for licensing fees for their patents.
41. 530gemini (Posts: 2198; Member since: 09 Sep 2010)
Let me give you a scenario remix.
You got yourself into a business. There are 5 other people who have been in that business years before you. They own technologies that are essential to be in that business. Since you are new, you have no choice but to pay them money every month for using their technologies, or else they would sue you. Although you are new in the business, you came up with your own fresh ideas, which you also patented for your protection. You became a big sensation and is now more successful than the others. Those other 5 companies who have been charging you fees for using their technology, like your ideas and are now using your fresh ideas FOR FREE, and they're making huge profits out of your fresh ideas as if it's their own. What would you do? :)