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Wall Street not impressed by the new Nokia Lumia models as Nokia's stock is downgraded by brokers

Posted: , by Alan F.

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Wall Street not impressed by the new Nokia Lumia models as Nokia's stock is downgraded by brokers
"Nokia's new Windows 8 devices will unlikely alter its muted smartphone market share trajectory in an ever more competitive smartphone market. We believe Nokia will struggle to regain sufficient market share with Windows 8 devices to offset increasing pressure on its mobile phone business from low-cost Android devices in 2013."-Kai Korschelt, analyst, Deutsche Bank
When Nokia introduced the brightly colored Nokia Lumia 920 and Nokia Lumia 820 earlier this week, many were impressed with the design of the new handsets. And with Windows Phone 8 allowing for larger screens with higher resolution, microSD slots and multi-core processors, Nokia would be able to better compete with the Apple iPhone and Android models. Yet, there was one group of influential people that did not jump for joy. Stock analysts, for the most part, were not  impressed with the new models and as a result, Nokia's stock was downgraded by a few major brokerage houses.

On Friday, brokerage firms Deutsche Bank and Societe Generale both downgraded Nokia's stock to sell. Analysts at Deutsche Bank said that the Nokia Lumia 820 and Nokia Lumia 920 won't stop Nokia's current downward sloping market share trend in the face of tougher competition. Deutsche Bank analyst Kai Korschelt told clients in a research note that low cost Android models will be taking market share away from Nokia in 2013. Since Nokia made a low in June, the stock had risen 50%. But the broker now has put a target of $2.05 USD on Nokia's stock, which is under the OEMs current stock price, and has a sell recommendation on the stock.

The new flagship, Nokia Lumia 920

The new flagship, Nokia Lumia 920

Societe Generale also downgraded the stock to sell, saying that all of the information, specs and features about the Nokia Lumia 920 and Nokia Lumia 820 had already been leaked leaving nothing left for investors to get excited about. In general, analysts and investors were upset that Nokia did not release pricing information and also did not offer a release date for the phones. On Friday, rumors started spreading about a November 2nd launch for the higher end Nokia Lumia 920.

While Wall Street sees Nokia missing an opportunity to light a fire under its stock, Jo Harlow, Senior VP of smart devices at Nokia, said that the launch of the two new models is a step in a journey. Harlow said that the Nokia Lumia 920 and Nokia Lumia 820 are not the only Windows Phone 8 models coming from the OEM . The executive says that "not one moment in time defines everything."  She said that Nokia provides plenty of differentiation of the OS using NFC compatibility and improved mapping.
"This characterization that it is the last step is not reality. These are two devices; they're not all the devices that we'll base on Windows Phone 8. This is our strategy and it's a journey; there's not one moment in time that defines everything."-Jo Harlow Senior VP of smart devices at Nokia

Those familiar with how the market works won't be surprised to hear that Nokia shares rose 7.32% on Friday to $2.64.

source: FierceWireless

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posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:06 8

2. Android4u (Posts: 456; Member since: 16 Aug 2012)


posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:10 1

3. phonton (Posts: 65; Member since: 27 Dec 2011)

The next choice for Nokia would be to ask APPLE to market their phones! The phones will sell like hot cakes nevertheless

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:12 5

4. redmd (Posts: 1367; Member since: 26 Oct 2011)

Why not release it earlier Nokia.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 00:43 4

25. Dr.Phil (Posts: 1639; Member since: 14 Feb 2011)

How can they? It's not like they wouldn't want to, but it's actually Microsoft's fault it will be released when it will be released. Nokia doesn't even have the final build of WP8 yet, and Microsoft has set a time table of late October to introduce both Windows 8 and WP8.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 10:59 1

63. Droid_X_Doug (Posts: 5993; Member since: 22 Dec 2010)

In retrospect, Nokia should not have done the announcement until late October if they weren't going to be able to ship until early November. In addition to botching the announcement, Nokia have basically killed whatever market they had for their current Lumia phones. Notice how they have further cut the price to clear out unsold inventory? The next financial results announcement is going to be worse than the most recent one, because in addition to the on-going cash burn, Nokia is going to have to write off unsold inventory of current Lumia handsets.

One more thing they could have learned from Apple.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 12:46

73. Rydsmith (unregistered)

Actually they don't. For Nokia, shipping their phones is actually considered a sale (when it comes to carriers). They sell them to the carriers at a wholesale price, let's just say around $400-450 for a $600 phone.

The carrier then sells them subsidized to the consumer at ~$100-200, gaining a customer for 2 years or getting ~$300 if the contract is ended early.

Mind you, this is from my knowledge working in the industry for the US.

NB! Nokia did foot a small fee for selling the Lumia 900 at a reduced cost on AT&T.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 14:50

80. Droid_X_Doug (Posts: 5993; Member since: 22 Dec 2010)

They don't what? Have to write off their inventory of unsold OG Lumias? Or?

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 19:23

88. MeoCao (unregistered)

They had to cut price of Lumias b-c of competition. The announcement gives them an excuse.

They would better do like you say if Lumias sell well.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 09:24 3

56. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Read the articles (I think The Verge had the most accurate info as they actually got to.play with some of the prototypes). The software isn't done yet, Microsoft is keeping features hidden even from the OEMs until announcement day, and even after that the OEMs have to install the software (RTM phase), get carrier approval (at least in the U.S. and Canada), then install the approved software on these hundreds of thousands of not millions of units, box them, ship them, and get them to warehouses and stores for sale. It takes several days at best to do that, but typically several weeks or months. Even longer if the factory is overseas and the devices have to be shipped by ship, which is why apple (and other companies who manufacture outside the U.S. makes their devices months in advance and stages them at warehouses for the initial preorders, so.they can be delivered to customers within weeks of ordering

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:18 9

5. rusticguy (Posts: 2828; Member since: 11 Aug 2012)

Nokia needs a reboot ... into Android. Elop may not want to pee in the pocket to feel the warmth but then he has no choice as he is trying to fish in a "pee puddle" in any case which isn't working.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 04:00 4

40. Glim12808 (Posts: 394; Member since: 26 Oct 2011)

Yeah right because Motorola, LG, and Sony are taking in loads of money on their Android lineups. Even HTC is almost scraping the bottom with their great Android phones. It seems there's only space for one OEM in the Android market, and that's Samsung.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 22:34

92. rusticguy (Posts: 2828; Member since: 11 Aug 2012)

Perhaps yes but then they are also wasting too much time on doing things that they know will fail. Waste time on explaining why no microSD card, why battery is not removal, why devices are being released in 2012 on GB etc. Samsung perhaps has got a better hold on what customers want and instead of trying to force their thought they are going by providing what market needs by and large.

2 year 50GB free account on dropbox isn't soemthing that can work on all markets as to upload those 50GB will also need money to be spent on data plan (and also recurring billing after 2 years) which would be far more expensive than a equivalent capacity microSD card i think. Yes Samsung also offeres 50GB drop box account but then they also offer expansion slot ... and then lets customer chose what's best .

By your logic Sony shouldn't be exploring WP8 (which they are considering) as no one seems to be really making money on WP except perhaps M$ :)

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 12:49 1

74. Rydsmith (unregistered)

Glim12808 hit it on the head.

Android is not the end-all-be-all salvation for phones. The only OEM that seems to be making a profit in the United States is Samsung. Even Asus tablets are losing money in their tablet division as it is android based.

HTC, Sony, LG, Motorola, Sharp (yes they did make a phone), all have not made large profits off android and have actually taken a hit on the OS.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 15:22

82. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)


Pantech, Dell, Acer, Asus, Huawei, and a few others who have sold Android haven't made huge profits off them. Partly due to pricing (undercut iphone pricing) and because they all come out with the same features at the same time with the same OS, minimal software add-ons (S-Voice, etc) and even the old overlays are dying out (TouchWiz, MOTOBlur, Sense) as OEMs cut development money for them and focus on the solid stock Android experience. In short, they're doing what Microsoft has been doing with Windows phone: same UI with a few pieces of software to differentiate, with slightly different specs here and there (PureView camera, Nokia Play, Music, etc) to enhance appeal

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 19:42

90. pikapowerize (banned) (Posts: 1869; Member since: 03 May 2012)

agree with you!! these company really dont make big profits from the android phones they sell!!but thats why android is really versatile.. i hate skinned android but thats how these manufacturer differentiate itself!!

its like symbian... nokia's symbian is different from motorola, sony-ericson and samsung!!!

but what makes makes me piss about Windows Phone and windows is that they cant differenciate!! they cant skin WP/win because it will never happen... all device running microsoft's software all look the same...but nokia's way of diffirentiation is through the exclusive lumia apps which is i think a good thing but a bad thing for other manufacturers that produce WP...

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:49 10

7. fanboy1974 (Posts: 1345; Member since: 12 Nov 2011)

I've been an Android fanboy for almost 3 years and the Nokia 920 made me rethink Windows 8. It might not make me switch over to WP8 but I do respect what I see.
The main problem I see is that they announced it without a solid release date and Apple's iPhone 5 will have already sold in huge numbers. And let's not forget the Samsung Galaxy Note 2. If your going to do battle release product asap.

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 23:40 3

15. Penny (Posts: 1672; Member since: 04 Feb 2011)

Yeah, the lack of an imminent release strategy is one of the worst things Nokia could have done in this situation in my opinion. If they announce it September 5 and release it November 2nd, they're just allowing any hype or buzz about the phone to die down before release.

It really is a solid product. I love that Nokia makes the effort to improve the hardware technologies of their devices that other manufacturers may put less emphasis on. However, while things like the 8.7 MP camera may technically be great, their investors and the general public were just looking for buzz words like 16/21 MP. Love the product but a misstep in business strategy.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 00:35 2

24. -POLICE- (Posts: 8; Member since: 23 Aug 2012)

Failed by hardware specs. Nokia allways has been.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 01:13 2

28. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

i am sure you dont even know the phone the guys talking about nither you know about the specs of the phone what a fat idiot it is head on specs with andoid u fool

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 12:50

75. Rydsmith (unregistered)

Calling someone an idiot and having "amazing" grammar like that is just astounding.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 19:51

91. pikapowerize (banned) (Posts: 1869; Member since: 03 May 2012)

lets not blame nokia here.. its microsoft's problem that WP8 is still not ready! but it will be nokia's problem too since the next iPhone will probably go on sale on the next few weeks and it might sell like hotcakes again coz its an apple device and the next thing for iPhone...

their socks are so down right now!! so nokia need to work with microsoft so close coz nokia was a part of making WP8!!

but its either fly or die here!! nokia should release and announce the price before apple will steal the spotlight with its mediocre iPhone (i like iphone but its really getting old...but these iPhone will be worthy to buy but the next next, dont think so)

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:55 4

8. lubba (Posts: 1313; Member since: 17 Jan 2011)

Alot of haters here. Oh well, God made them. What can we do.

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 22:03 4

12. JoeBelfiore (banned) (Posts: 79; Member since: 03 Sep 2012)

Fandroids... dont be surprised by having tons of thumb down on even a positive comment regarding iPhone/WP

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 01:15 2

29. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

i wonder what these andoid lovers do all day visit nokia /WP8 artiles only does they have nothing better to do does they hate being challenged by new OS and the hate in them is just fasinating all u Andoid guys get a life and stop trolling even apple fans dont troll like u noobs

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 09:27 1

57. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

And the iphoners thumb down on Android articles. Can't we all just get along?

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 21:57 4

9. InspectorGadget80 (unregistered)

Wall STREET doesn't know JACK. They only like their iPhones. they don't care for any other product

posted on 07 Sep 2012, 23:54 3

19. Droid_X_Doug (Posts: 5993; Member since: 22 Dec 2010)

Wall Street doesn't need to know jack. The reason they like Apple is that Apple manages to give ship date and pricing when they announce their toys. Apple also manages to meet their published ship dates.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 09:34 1

58. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

The 4S initial shipments kept getting delayed. Some who preordered as soon as it went live didn't get theirs until after they were available in stores. Massively under prepared, or clever marketing gimmick trying to create artificial demand because of artificially low supply? Reminds me of the Futurama episode "Attack of the Killer App" where the eyePhone is sold in store and the retail worker says "I think I have one more", reaches through a flexible barrier, and grabs one of the boxes piled high to the ceiling.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 11:07

64. Droid_X_Doug (Posts: 5993; Member since: 22 Dec 2010)

We aren't talking about a 1 1/2 month delay on the 4S. There is a difference. Worst case, those who had per-ordered and experienced a delay could have gone to an Apple store and picked up a 4S and then cancelled their pre-order.

posted on 08 Sep 2012, 11:44

69. Droid_X_Doug (Posts: 5993; Member since: 22 Dec 2010)

Edit - pre-(ordered) instead of per.

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