Apple cans employee over an iPhone rant on Facebook
One instance that was cited was when Crisp was trying out an app for his iPhone, he posted, “****ed up my time zone for the third time in a week and woke me up at 3am? JOY!!” Another was when Apple posted “Tomorrow is just another day. That you’ll never forget.” to hint at the upcoming Beatles release to iTunes, Crisp responded, “Tomorrow’s just another day that hopefully I will forget.”
Unfortunately, one of his friends on Facebook, who was also a co-worker, showed all of Crisp’s posts to their boss, which led to his termination. Crisp attempted to file for unemployment, but was denied. The employment tribunal panel stated, “We take into account their position that the Facebook posts were not truly private and could in fact have been forwarded very easily with the claimant having no control over this process.”
source: Metro via Redmond Pie
1. LewsTherin006 (Posts: 140; Member since: 18 Nov 2011)
And another good reason why you dont rant/ putting anything important on facebook. It can get your fired.
23. jogutier (Posts: 324; Member since: 12 Feb 2010)
Dang, what happen to freedom of speech. O' we r talking about natzees. Lol
26. andro. (Posts: 1971; Member since: 16 Sep 2011)
Apple employees are placed under massive mental pressure to keep smiling and talk well of apple at all times. Their induction training involves them being tied to a chair with eyes held open and subjected to several 'apple is good,you love apple' training videos until their mental resolve succumbs to the apple darkness that now surrounds them!
42. E.N. (Posts: 2357; Member since: 25 Jan 2009)
If I own a company and someone is being sarcastic like that I'd fire them too. If the employee wasn't happy with the company he was working for and the products they make, then the boss did them both a favor by firing the guy.
The only thing that kind of sucks is that a "friend" turned him in.....ouch
60. impaler (Posts: 3; Member since: 04 Dec 2011)
You're right. I heard someone reference Facebook and most public websites with the analogy of an open window. Don't be stupid. Assume mom and dad will read it. Assume your wife/girlfriend/husband/boyfriend will read it. Be smart. Assume it'll be in the public forever.
2. bossmt_2 (Posts: 437; Member since: 13 Oct 2009)
That's why you never list your job or have pictures of you in company attire on facebook. If you do you can be misconstrued as representing the company, if not, then you can probably sue for wrongful firing.
39. tedkord (Posts: 5138; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
It wouldn't matter in this case. Apple security would just show up claiming to be police detectives from your local precinct and go through your PC looking for incriminating evidence.
53. Kease (Posts: 36; Member since: 30 Sep 2011)
Actually many companies today have similar policies disclosed in their hiring process...
3. Adianshadows (Posts: 66; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)
I would go back and punch that co worker in the face for showing their boss... snitches get stiches IMO... :)
5. remixfa (Posts: 14080; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
never bring your co-workers onto your FB, never make your posts public, and never talk too much crap about your job.. especially apple.. they have the fruit gestapo!! lol
6. Gawain (Posts: 371; Member since: 15 Apr 2010)
I wonder if he would have been fired, if this had been passed along as hearsay - i.e. if this guy Crisp had ranted while having a few beers with friends at the bar. Not totally oranges-to-oranges comparison (it stays on the internet *forever*), but you get the gist...
48. TMobileRep_52_SwaaaG (Posts: 40; Member since: 03 Oct 2011)
Or...... 'Apple to Apple' comparison..... ope see what i did there?? haha
7. corporateJP (Posts: 1765; Member since: 28 Nov 2009)
As much as I'm unimpressed with a good amount of Apple gadgetry, I'd have to tell you I'm on their side on this one.
This guy is simply a moron.
10. iamcc (Posts: 1319; Member since: 07 Oct 2011)
I don't understand why... Just because he works for Apple doesn't mean his free speech rights are taken away. Maybe if he was venting about his boss being an idiot or something, but to complain about problems with his personal device?
They wouldn't have cared if he was venting about his Android phone having problems, just because he works for Apple and has an iPhone shouldn't change it in my opinion.
38. Paden (Posts: 262; Member since: 07 Jul 2011)
Your freedom of speech taken away? Please.
Microsoft canned a blogger when a superior got an e-mail that had the signature "Sent from my iPhone".
Publicly posting something negative about a company event would be enough for any employer to get upset.
corporateJP: Yes, agreed. This guy is an idiot. Vent to your friends about work over a beer and not the internet.
41. ReturningToNokia (Posts: 130; Member since: 09 Jul 2011)
iamcc...When you get hired by a company, one should always read the fine print, and the Spirit Letter...rules and conduct regarding Social Networks/Posting online is covered, and when you sign on the dotted line, you must abide by those rules as one of the conditions of employment.
Perhaps small companies, or mom and pop companies don't have such requirements, but mostly all Fortune 100 companies do. And apparently, Apple, regardless of location, has such conduct requirements. It's also possible that his job performance was also a consideration....
8. ilia1986 (unregistered)
So, If I work for a certain company - suddenly the content of what I write on the internet is moderated lest I write something hateful about that same company?
Really? I thought that there is this little something in America called "Free speech".
I'm from Israel - a country which is arguably far from being as advanced as the US is - but over here *you do not get fired from your job just because you posted on Facebook on your personal profile something negative about it (your job)*.
It certainly shocks me that you guys are all in for the Big Bad Apple. This is absolutely ridiculous.
11. mctcm (Posts: 204; Member since: 19 Oct 2011)
There is also something called "Right to work." He can continue his free speech while unemployed.
12. ilia1986 (unregistered)
So if you're employed - and you come back home, off duty, your private life - you don't have any free speech?
How stupid is that?!
15. Hallucinator (Posts: 344; Member since: 24 May 2010)
The only stupid thing is that you can not understand why this is wrong for him to do so.
18. ilia1986 (unregistered)
Just because I work for a certain company does NOT mean that I must instantly switch my opinions in favor of that company when in the first place I used to think differently. Simple as that. The CEO of nVidia is allowed to say that Radeon cards are better. Someone working @ McDonald's is allowed to say that the food there sucks. A salesman returning home from work is allowed to post on the internet that the product that he is actually selling - is bogus.
At least in my country.
Sad to hear that it's not like that everywhere else.
21. jburris020 (Posts: 17; Member since: 28 Nov 2011)
Doesn't the post say he works in the U.K? Does freedom of speech apply
37. biophone (Posts: 1896; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Freedom if speech is misinterpeted so often. All it means is that you wont get thrown in jail for what you say. You still have to deal with the consquences of what you say. A company can fire their employees because of speech just cant thriw them in jail.
45. r41nier (Posts: 63; Member since: 13 Oct 2011)
take a business course and you'll know why this act is unacceptable. read about competence, core values, and employee hiring.
49. TMobileRep_52_SwaaaG (Posts: 40; Member since: 03 Oct 2011)
did your business course say anything about direct company policy? i took business values and business law and both were pretty clear that a company withheld the right to protect their assest (i.e. their product in this case) and if their policy had a firm ground on what u post on social networks, then they are clean and clear to do what they (the company) feels it has to do.
58. remixfa (Posts: 14080; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
this is a common issue these days.
I dont know about the rest of the world, but in america most states are concidered "right to work". Basically, you can be fired at any time for any reason.
While it is not illegal to shout your hatred for your boss from the tops of the hills (or facebook profile), it is in bad taste. As such, you are making PUBLIC declarations disparaging your job. It may be your "private" life, but you are doing it in a public domain. As such, in a public domain, your employer might be listening and has the right to protect their image (and/or be vindictive depending on the case) and release you from employment.
If you want to vent about your boss, do it with your friends at home or somewhere where you dont have to worry about the wrong people hearing it. Do NOT put it on your facebook profile.
Many companies these days hire people that can scour the internet (everything you post is searchable to some extent) to find what you are really saying about things. Not only can you lose your job by facebook rants, you can be turned down from a job that finds these rants after interviewing you.
13. nicknack84 (Posts: 15; Member since: 02 Dec 2011)
there is free speech in the US, however this took place in Norwich, UK and not the US.
16. ilia1986 (unregistered)
So what? The UK is no less of a democracy than the US is.
31. Gawain (Posts: 371; Member since: 15 Apr 2010)
Um, the UK is a Constitutional Monarchy, with a parliament that elects their Prime Minister and still has royalty as its Chief of State. Only members of the House of Commons are directly elected. The US is a Federal Republic which has far more direct voting to government than any pariamentary democracy. So, yes, I'll argue that the UK is, in fact, less "democratic" (a word that is thrown around far to recklessly).
32. geedup (banned) (Posts: 74; Member since: 01 Dec 2011)
Wow ilia getting crushed with his ignorance here
30. Gawain (Posts: 371; Member since: 15 Apr 2010)
Free speech has not been impeded here. Employment is not a protection under the Constitution. Most states have "at will" employment laws, making it possible for an employer to fire, or employee to quit, for any reason.
This employee however, works in the UK. They have whole other set of laws, etc, but I'm sure they aren't favorable to the "employee" per se.
40. rcrider4 (Posts: 118; Member since: 14 Nov 2011)
Yes he did have free speech. No one stopped him from saying that message, and it is still probably sitting in his FaceBook page. Companies also have a right to fire employees. If we all used that argument, I could go into work and blab to customers about how much my company sucked, and they could fire me. If you do it in a place where your boss or coworkers could see or hear it, it is their right to fire you. So he was just being stupid to post that to the world. Say it to your friends, not the Internet. That's how you keep a job.
9. xq10xa (Posts: 143; Member since: 07 Dec 2010)
He should consult with the Geniuses and see if they can do that Vulcan ritual that I saw on South Park. Maybe that will get him back in there. They can't fail!
14. Hallucinator (Posts: 344; Member since: 24 May 2010)
You people talking about free speech need to get over it. If you bad mouth your job publicly as an employee of any company they have the right to fire you. I manage an eye doctors office. If I go home and start talking trash about them on Fb, I am still representing my company even though I am off duty and there for causing damage to their name.
27. iamcc (Posts: 1319; Member since: 07 Oct 2011)
There's a difference. He said nothing bad about the company, he has an issue with a product of theirs.
If you go home and say that the eye doctor where you work is unqualified, unsanitary, or whatever; yes. You should be fired (or reprimanded).
If you go home and say that your particular brand of glasses just broke for the third time, and that eye doctor also happens to carry that brand; no. You should not be fired (or reprimanded).
Maybe we just have a difference in opinion, but saying "screw Apple they just gave another customer a refurbished device and told him it was brand new!!" is very different than "my iPhone just screwed up the time zone for the third time and woke me up early!"
34. Hallucinator (Posts: 344; Member since: 24 May 2010)
I agree with pretty much everything you said except for the fact that these were just excerpts taken from what he said and not the whole story. Also one could argue that him making snide remarks about what Apple believed to be a big day in the Beatles catalog release(Although I don't care) could be considered derogatory.
17. Whateverman (Posts: 3231; Member since: 17 May 2009)
This guy had every right to rant about his about his phone, but you gotta be smart about it. Rant verbally to your wife, your family and friends who are not co-workers. But never, NEVER put it on line where it can be seen by everyone.
19. geedup (banned) (Posts: 74; Member since: 01 Dec 2011)
For those saying Apple is wrong if you ran a small business and your employee trashed the company on facebook what would you do?
20. downphoenix (Posts: 2389; Member since: 19 Jun 2010)
It should be illegal to fire people over this. Companies have no right to intrude in our private lives.
36. jburris020 (Posts: 17; Member since: 28 Nov 2011)
It isn't private when you post your life on the web.
22. networkdood (Posts: 6310; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)
Also, when you rant on facebook, you can hide it from certain individuals - too bad it is too late.
25. fervid (Posts: 173; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)
Wow, this is dumb. Sounds to me like the real Bad Apple was the coworker that forwarded private messages. I see nothing wrong or against their company in the posts mentioned. Was the app he was ticked off at even made by Apple? It isn't like his messages were saying Apple is the worst company I've ever worked for. Neither were specifically targeted to his company. If anything needs to take place it is more protection of what we post online. It is text we write and pictures we take, so should have copyrights applied to it so when jerks like his coworker steal it they can get sued. I'm tired of the music, video, and photography side claiming copyrights to everything, it is time we the everyday people get protection. Pictures I take and words I say should have just as much protection. I can't even take professional photos on my own and print them without the photo places thinking they are too good to be mine. Most professional ones others do are horrible and I have to touch them up just to get quality pictures. Why should some kid in a photo studio that has no idea how to take a picture have more rights than me?
28. Sniggly (Posts: 7180; Member since: 05 Dec 2009)
Unfortunately I can't say this situation is unfamiliar to me. A couple of years ago I was working for an outsourced call center which was Verizon's first warranty department. I was put on an automatic final warning because I made a single side comment about the KRZR. When an indirect store agent called in about one with a white screen of death, I remarked "that doesn't surprise me." I was told that had Verizon listened to that call I would have been terminated immediately.
Also, the Best Buy guy who made the HTC EVO vs. iPhone 4 video was very nearly canned.
29. cupcake (Posts: 106; Member since: 15 Apr 2010)
whoa holy crap I'm sure glad that I decided to work for Verizon instead of Apple
33. geedup (banned) (Posts: 74; Member since: 01 Dec 2011)
Verizon would fire you for this too. Read above comment. Companies don't take kindly to negative comments made in public about them.
43. cnpthe3rd (Posts: 51; Member since: 01 Feb 2009)
no one has infringed on his freedom he is free to speak as he pleases it is just apple is also free to want employees who like apple. should your freedom extend to your work place, probably but also should you be working for a place that makes products that you think suck.
44. Vzw_employee (Posts: 42; Member since: 01 Sep 2011)
Okay , first the guy is a moron, I work for Verizon, but my personal phone is Sprint, I am not gonna tell people that Sprint is a good quality product and at a much reasonable price than Verizon, not in person, not on the web, I never use my sprint phone at work , is just common sense, if you aren't happy with your job then quit, don't try to put down the company that puts money in your bank.
46. Simba501 (Posts: 27; Member since: 06 Jul 2011)
Who's the douche that showed all of the posts....
50. tmcr7 (Posts: 161; Member since: 02 Nov 2011)
How ironic that a Google Engineer who committed the same act using harsher words was NOT fired.
Funny how Apple gets away with imperialistic measures like this, apart from sending thousands of jobs away from homeland to exploit cheap labor in China. Then sell overpriced iPhones and iPads to Americans for maximum profit.
Apple is the number 1 company in US but the American economy is in the dumps because of corporate greed. Funny how Americans can allow this to happen in the land of the free.
52. noahbf (Posts: 28; Member since: 28 Apr 2009)
Kind of interesting to see this and compare it to the story of a Google employee posting on Google+ all the things he didn't like about google+ and the company.
He didn't get fired.
56. roscuthiii (Posts: 1864; Member since: 18 Jul 2010)
That just makes Google a more understanding company and probably a friendlier work environment. Or at least that they understand an opportunity for good PR.
Both Google and Apple were within their rights to terminate employment with someone they didn't want representing them. It's like businesses that post that they reserve the right to refuse service to anyone.
54. Larry_ThaGr81 (Posts: 294; Member since: 26 May 2011)
I don't know about this one, did he specifcially mention any Apple products or the name itself in a negatively? If not, then he didn't deface their brand image/name and Apple is wrong for terminating him.
55. Larry_ThaGr81 (Posts: 294; Member since: 26 May 2011)
I had training on how to avoid creating a negative image for my employer through the use of social networking sites. I'll just leave it at that or someone that works for my employer may identify me to someone of power at my job.
57. roscuthiii (Posts: 1864; Member since: 18 Jul 2010)
No freedom of speech issue here. He's still free to state his feelings as he likes. Freedom of speech just protects you from going to jail for expressing them. And even then, you're not protected in the case of treason, or something like yelling "Fire!" in a theater. You still have to face the consequences of your expression/speech.
Now, does it make Apple a Dick employer? Damn straight it does. Google handled it much better when they had a similar episode earlier this year. They at the very least understand the difference between a good PR opportunity and a bad PR mishap.
Apparently Apple either hasn't gotten the memo that word of these things spread quickly nowadays due to the cloud we call the internet, or they simply just don't care. I'd suggest they Google it, but that is probably forbidden for an Apple employee as well.