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HTC One lifts company to its best month in a year, but COO leaves amidst employee turmoil

0. phoneArena posted on 04 Jun 2013, 05:34

HTC has released its financial results for the past month of May 2013, and it has become the company’s strongest month in the past year …

This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 09:11

29. taz89 (Posts: 2014; Member since: 03 May 2011)

Agree.. Also if the 5million if true then why don't htc say it officially as that is certainly good news for them again if true but I have my doubt as I expected some sort of confirmation by htc by now.. What better way to cover negative news of eemployees leaving than to say you have just sold this much.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 09:57

37. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

If you keep think about it, it gets worse. According to the revenue, htc one was outsold by htc one x, s and whatever they were selling last year combined. But the combined htc numbers were horrible last year and S3 easily outsold anything htc, nokia, sony all combined. So, my question is how does htc get 5 mil from selling less than what they sold last year which was a very small number to start with.

Another thing, htc said they're going to double production of htc one. This means they're going to make 10mil per month (if 5mil number is right). This is like saying htc(mid-sized company) has about the same production capacity as samsung(one of the biggest company, and #1 phone maker in the world). Remember, samsung had hard time making 10mil of S4s in May, they were pushing their production capacity to the limit.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 10:48

40. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

I don't think you're doing the calculations correctly. Just because 5 million or even Samsung's 10 million devices were sold in May, that doesn't mean the production started in May.

I think the 3.3% difference from last year may have come from the HTC One S also. Last year there were 3 devices from the One series and HTC One S was selling quite well while the HTC One X was really just mediocre but really bad in the public's eyes. The One S was given a high review for a mid-tier device. So the HTC One X, S and V plus whatever discounted phone before probably made up the $967 million and the extra 3.3%.

As for HTC this year, there's the HTC One, the continuous sales of Butterfly and whatever older devices there is. The majority of the sales went to HTC at 5 million unit sold in May.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 11:55

42. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Your reasoning only strengthens my points. htc had production delays(around march-april) and camera shortage (around late april- early may), this means their production didn't really get going until May.
Samsumg was preparing for S4 without any major production delays, which means they probably had more made before May than htc. So even with better preparation, samsung had hard time making 10mi during april-may period. For htc to make anywhere near 5mi units during this time(approx. 1month) and now near 10mi per month(since they doubled production), they would have to have not equal but higher production capacity than samsung. Last time i checked, samsung was #1 and htc was like #10(if that) in smartphone.

Now, according to the htc's May revenue, htc one was outsold by all htc phones (including one s) from last year. S3 outsold all htc phones with easy last year. And this year, S4 outsold S3 by considerable margin so far. My point is that htc one probably sold fraction of a fraction of S4, not half as claimed by an unnamed source. (In terms of numbers sold: S4>S3>>all htc phones>htc one) I may be wrong because i'm extrapolating from known facts and news. But It seems to me, all indications are that htc 5 mi sold in May is very unlikely, if not impossible.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 12:10

43. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Sorry my mistake, htc was ranked #4 smartphone maker in 2012..

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 12:48

44. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

Delayed manufacturing does not mean no production process at all. For all we know, the production problem could be near end of production then more production problem arose from other parts of the production process after the 1st batch. There's no argument that Samsung is the number 1 with the highest production capacity, but the ranking between companies will not dictate what their production capacity is. Everyone is thinking HTC produced 5 million in a month and will be doubling production using the 5 million figure, but that's really not the correct figure.

I agree with you that the 5 million sold in May in unlikely and impossible, because the 5 million sale is really accumulated over 2 months. Your comparison based on revenue S4>S3>all HTC phones (2012 devices: X, S, V, XL, EVO 4G LTE, X+), is correct but we're comparing 2012 and 2013 HTC sales. The comparison should strictly be between 2012's devices vs 2013's One and sales continuation from the Butterfly. The quantity of HTC One could exceed the sales of any other One series devices, but revenue will surely be lower because there's less phone models being released this year. You really can't use revenue to compare quantity sold, because revenue involved all other sales not just on a single device and a single device does not stand for all the revenue gained.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 12:54

46. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

For ex: my current business is selling BBQ chicken. My #1 item is the bowl, but my combination of chow mein and combos exceed the bowl in quantity. The revenue generation from bowl vs combo and chow mein depend on whether the combo sold more or chow mein sold more.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:22

48. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

All my calculations are based on very rough estimations. But, even with my rough estimations htc one seems to come up short by a wide margin. I'm actually being very generous with htc one numbers here because i'm assuming all of htc May revenue comes from only the sales of htc one (I'm overestimating htc one numbers). I'm saying even with the overestimated numbers, htc one failed to outsell S3 by a wide margin, much less S4.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:33

49. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

Your conclusion is very correct on a month to month basis and it's a solid fact and S3 and S4 both outsold their competitor outrageously. Over time, the difference will become even greater. The reason why the calculations are incorrect because you're comparing HTC's May revenue/total quantity of HTC one sold of 5 million from March to May to total quantity sold by S4 in it's first month. Once Samsung's revenue report comes out, you'll see that Samsung revenue will still beat HTC by far like it should. There really isn't a problem in amount of HTC Ones sold, because I'm sure once Samsung releases it's revenue report, all the ratios will look correct.

Now back to comparing 2012 and 2013 for HTC. HTC One and with Butterfly on the side is bring them back from death bed and still collecting more momentum and sales, while the One series last year really didn't move them at all.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:34

50. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Your point would make sense if i underestimated htc numbers, but i actually overestimated it.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:40

51. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

I'm sure htc one will do pretty good numbers at the end of this quarter. but i get really annoyed by people and web sites throwing 5mi number as a fact without any proof or verification.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:51

53. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

The 5 million sold was already announced by Peter Chou. I read the Taiwanese news 2 days ago. Everyone's blowing the 5 millions devices sold up like it was all sold in May. The real fact is that's the figure sold in a little more than 2 months.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 14:00

55. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Well, that shut me up. Well, if it's true, then i was wrong. Good for htc.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 14:14

56. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

I went to taipei times newspaper, and it said nothing about Peter Chou announcing 5 mi sold. I'm not calling you a liar or anything, but my point still stands unless you can show proof (link to newspaper article,,)

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 14:43

58. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

Yeah, I went looking for that article I read, but I couldn't find it. So I'm not going to base any of my arguments on that. The Taiwanese news I read are directly from Taiwan news where everything is original in Chinese and un-translated. We could ignore my post about Peter Chou's announcement but read my post below. I'm trying to explain how HTC One could be outselling 2012 devices, but still causing HTC to gain less revenue compared to last year.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:46

52. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

It's your over estimation of HTC number make HTC One's sales look impossible.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 13:57

54. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

i don't think you're getting my point. if overestimated number can not beat samsung numbers, how can a actual number(which is less than overestimated number) beat samsumg numbers.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 14:39

57. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

I get your point and I already said your conclusion about HTC vs Samsung is correct. However, the sales figure of HTC One is possible, considering the sales figures is accumulated over 2 months.

Your question was asking how can HTC claim to sell 5 million units while gaining lower revenue compared to last year while all HTC devices last year were completely outsold by Samsung. The comparison should of been done apples to apples with HTC sales. By bringing in Samsung production capability, you made it look more like Samsung vs HTC instead of HTC 2012 vs 2013.

Like I've said in previous comments, the 5 million figure is calculated over 2 months, while you claimed it was in May only due to production and part. The item was launched in different countries since end of March. That means the shipping of the devices has begun but in very limited quantities. There are many parts in production process, we will never know which part is the problem. If the whole production process is the problem and production completed halted, then that's something else. There could be a possibility that only part of the production was having problems while the rest of the production was able to continue what was needed. It caused delay in shipment, but it doesn't stop the production line entirely. So, 5 million produced over 2 months compared to Samsung produced 10 million over 2 months. The ratios is still looking correct.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 15:02

59. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

So now, let's take Samsung out of the picture because it's a no brainer that it'll outsell HTC on any given ground at this point.

HTC's May revenue is down 3.3 compared to last year.

So HTC's May revenue last year is approximately 998,911,000 with the revenue gained divided by the following devices: HTC One X, S, V, XL and the rest of the old phones.

This year May revenue of $967 million is pretty much HTC One and Butterfly as the main sellers plus the rest of the old phones. The revenue will definitely be lower because there's only two phones really selling at this point but the two phones would have a higher total device sold.

Going back to the total HTC One sold, whether or not if it's 5 million sold, the total of 5 million sold is over 2 month. Therefore not all the 5 million device generated revenue will be applied to the $967 million in May.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 15:08

60. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

I forgot to include EVO 4G LTE, Desire C, and HTC J for 2012 HTC phone sold around May and April.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 15:45

61. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Okay, htc shipped 32.6mi in 2012 according to estimates. this comes out to about 2.7mi per month. So your statement htc one selling about 2.5mi per month (=5mi in two months) is definitely do-able. So if this is true, you're right, and what i said is right as well(since it's half of half of S4 number/S4 started selling in May I believe).

However, I still have hard time believing 5mi for htc. As you said, htc sold "very limited quantities" in april (i believe htc one started selling in US around beginning of May or just before). I think very limited quantities in april ~ maybe 1mi. which means 4 mi in May. But this year's May revenue is less than last year's. As for last year's May number, we can probably estimate it as 3mi(high estimate). And this 3 mi mostly includes cheaper phones than htc one, meaning htc one number will be less than 3mi. I'm giving very high estimates, but even then htc one number at most comes out to 4mi in two months.

I don't think we're ever gonna agree on 5 mi. so let's agree to disagree. As for me, I don't think 5mi is a ridiculous number anymore, but i still think it's a very unlikely number for them.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 16:15

62. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

I think you're the first person I had this kind of conversation and actually was able to end the conversation quite nicely on this site. It's great to actually have a sophisticated ending to a conversation without any name calling.

That was my opinion from the beginning that the 5 million is possible, but we'll just have to see whether or not it's really true. Usually HTC quarterly reports doesn't include devices sold, but if we take a look at the revenue gain at the end of this quarter and compare to last year, we should be able to see if HTC One really did the job for HTC this year. Whether or not the 5 million is reach, I won't use that as an argument since I can't find the article to back it up. I think it's safe to assume that HTC One has outsold each (not in total of all the handsets together of course) of HTC's former handsets in 2nd quarter of 2012 (HTC One X sold 2 million back in May of 2012, One S sold well on T-Mobile USA, but I thought it would surpass HTC One X sales at a worldwide standpoint).

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 08:03 2

21. wendygarett (unregistered)

And then the title say best month... Pftt

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 06:17 3

13. sniperdroid (Posts: 146; Member since: 23 May 2013)

Executives leaving the company means there's something happening we're not aware of, I hope the company makes through it though because I usually feel for the regular employees who work there. Not having a job in this economy is harsh.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 09:29

31. rizevnarastek (Posts: 349; Member since: 06 Sep 2012)

Those people that left the company didn't leave, they were let go but the correct term would be that they left. They were the culprits of anti-productivity and they deserve to be booted. HTC is a company that does good and means well. It's their spirit. Going on a spree to give the boot to bad apples and start doing things right is the right way to go. Focus on good and do it better and put some serious marketing behind it with the right people for the job. I'd ransack all the leaders as well because that leakage gives the competition a heads up that diminishes your advances. I mean I love a good leak to keep me waiting all salivating but honestly that does more bad than it does good.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 11:00

41. gwuhua1984 (Posts: 1237; Member since: 06 Mar 2012)

Usually when there's resignations like this, it doesn't mean the company is doing bad. When the company is doing bad, Peter Chou will be the first to be asked to leave. It's really just politics. You do good, you stay. You don't do good, you're terminated. You don't like how the company is not being ran the way you like it, you quit.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 08:29 1

22. leaderpvp (Posts: 17; Member since: 26 May 2013)

We don't really know the reason of leaving... do they leave by themselves or they got fired.
In case they got fired, there probably was a strong arguing about device's success, or, due to First's crash. These who was responsive for the agreement with facebook, and, didn't take in account facebook home release in few days - FAIL, must get fired! this is critical mistake.
I believe inside the company is much more argues on different things, as in any other company...

Personally, I want to believe that these got fired, to hire employers who better suits these positions.

At the end, COO was working for 3 years in HTC. The last 3 years was very poor for HTC, they slided down with every month.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 08:36 1

23. indianapple89 (Posts: 47; Member since: 28 Feb 2013)

Not to mention they had supply chain problems with the HTC One. Something I guess that the COO is responsible for.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 09:33

33. rizevnarastek (Posts: 349; Member since: 06 Sep 2012)

As far as I saw it the First had a really good chance to succeed with the "young" population... HTC One for the hardcore and HTC first for kids and shallow pockets. It's a great and beautiful device running stock android for a really low price. If they'd put it on sale global it would be a WIN-WIN situation.

posted on 04 Jun 2013, 08:52 1

25. jdoee100 (Posts: 334; Member since: 04 Jun 2013)

Htc did good job making htc one, but now they're trying to compete with samsung straight up by expanding htc one lineup with mini, phablet,,,,, CEO is clearly panicking and trying to do everything at once, but they don't have the manpower nor the money to compete with samsung at this point. People are getting overworked and overstressed.
What they need to do is come up with htc one phablet as soon as possible before samsung note3 and keep building their brand. and perhaps expand their lineup further down the road, maybe next year. Expanding when they should be contracting is going to be their downfall.

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