Apple reportedly resumes production of the iPhone X as iPhone XS/XS Max sales lag

Unable to meet its contractual obligations with Samsung for OLED panels due to weaker than expected sales of the Apple iPhone XS and iPhone XS Max, Apple is reportedly restarting production of the iPhone X.
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100 Comments

78. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

A heck of a lot more. The Note 8/S9/S9+ alone makes all the latest iPhones look severally overpriced and even though the majority won't buy another brand of phone in place of an iPhone. But they aren't buying the iPhone either. For me I will only buy Apple or Samsung. No other option for iOS. And I will never own another vanilla Android phone. And other Android options just suck. Prices never matter to me because i buy a phone every year and when i sell them i never get less than 60% it's original price. So i always get 2 phones in 2 years for the price of one. But the iPhone hasn't changed enough in the past 5 years to consider anything above an iPhone 7 or 8.

5. Valdomero

Posts: 662; Member since: Nov 13, 2012

Charging such a ridiculous price for a phone is something not many people are willing to pay. Remember Vertu? the luxury company went broke because almost no-one bought those mid-range phones at such a high price. Apple tries to diffirentiate from the other OEMS as a "unique, stylish brand", which they are in some extent, but they're not a luxury brand per se. The little thing that made them sink in sales this season was that the money they were asking for their phones couldn't stand strong against what they offer, there's no balance this year. The XS is almost the same as the X, just a teeny beety better, the XS Max is just a jumbo XS, and the XR... oh my goodness, that was the Achilles heel of 2018's lineup. Like Achilles, it has every checkmark on the departments of battery, performance, audio/video (hold on), connectivity (apple-wise), BUT the heel was the screen. That 720p screen althought it's indistinguishable from a certain distance, it was NOT nice from Apple to offer a 720p screen for $750. A month before launch was enough time to destroy the hype of the phone for many, as well as the pricing. I would rather have a 1080p screen with the A11 chip instead of the current build. The rest of the phone is fine, even the bezels. Also removing the X from the lineup proves that this 10th anniversary iPhone is a better value than this 2018 fiasco.

19. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

The display is one of the best (non-HDR) displays on the market, better than the one in iP8 which still sells like crazy (the only minus I could find are the colors, a bit colder than on XS); the price is also OK (you mostly get it for free from the carriers all over the world with an average price plan - maybe it's because of bf, who knows).

6. Valdomero

Posts: 662; Member since: Nov 13, 2012

Hope Apple realize we want more offerings than more MSRP on their phones.

7. kennybenny

Posts: 211; Member since: Apr 10, 2017

I guess Apple has a lesson to learn.... To keep the previous model and drop the price.... Not discontinue the previous model and release the newer and the so called "budget" model. Apple may have made a big mistake with the release date of the XR, delaying the release date about 6 weeks could've cost Apple millions maybe even billions. This strategy has backfired for Apple. If the XR were released the same month as the XS it could have been a success.....

33. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

No. The XR, if anyone wanted it would have waited because if the lower price versus the other models. But after waiting, they ended up with a phone every reviewee is saying is bit worth the price. They could have dropped rhe iPhone X to $800 and gave it the A12 and gave it the same cameras as the XS. And that would have been better. But a $750 for 720p is a frikkin shame even for Apple. That would be like a car dealer charging you $4000 for ugly steel wheels vs alloy rims.

9. whatev

Posts: 2155; Member since: Oct 28, 2015

They shouldn’t have discontinued the iPhone X, this year iPhone lineup is very short compared to last year, and it’s more expensive as well, the smartphone market is so commoditized that it’s not necessary to upgrade your phone every year, I hope there’s a shift in the smartphone industry towards real modular phones where you can upgrade cpu, ram, and other components like pc’s so there’s no need to upgrade so frequently

20. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

Last year were 7 models, this year are... 7 models; how is that shorter? "you can upgrade cpu, ram, and other components like pc’s" I would love to see that, but Apple has gone a different direction - the iPhone direction - when it comes to laptops too (it's a bitch and expensive as hell to upgrade a Macbook) so unfortunately it's hard to hope for that.

28. whatev

Posts: 2155; Member since: Oct 28, 2015

Last year they had a wide lineup: SE, 6S, 7, 8, X and now 7, 8, Xr, Xs, they are not covering the same price range either, the iPhone 7 in Europe costs more than 500€, while SE last year was below that price, I upgraded to the XS from my 2 year old 7 and I was considering the XR but I couldn’t wait and I found the XS a lot more beautiful than the XR, I also upgraded to the new iPad Pro, but not everyone is willing to go to the premium model all the time especially when prices are rising like this, I honestly think apple can’t be raising prices just like that, I’m glad they are seeing this resilience from people (if this actually turns to be true, let’s remember every year analysts say Apple is going bankrupt and is doomed and then apple ultimately gets what it wants) so they wake up a little bit, I love apple but I recognize when they need a good spank

32. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

I forgot about the SE; you are right: last year there were 8 models, this year there are only 7 :). I don't like the prices either, but Apple - being the company that it is and providing the wide area of services (both free and paid) that are bundled in its devices - can't possibly sell the iPhone cheaper than 1k$ Samsungs and Huaweis. I also have a 7 and decided I won't upgrade at all this year (my backup is a 5s, which also got a new life with iOS 12 so I was set) but the devil was not ok with that and he sent me an offer for a free XR so, after thinking if XS is worth an extra 350€ - for me it's not - I decided to take the devil's offer. I heard this phrase in a movie (Seinfeld I think): "retail prices are for suckers"

10. scarface21173

Posts: 646; Member since: Aug 17, 2014

Sadley for apple its all about the profit margin to appease there shareholders. They need 60+% mark up on every product. Selling less product meant only one thing huge price increases. What will they do next year selling even less products increase there margins even more. There going to price themselves out of the game.

11. kevin007in

Posts: 327; Member since: Oct 28, 2015

As if iphone X sales were too good.. hahaha APPLE is becoming really funny. This is what they deserve.

13. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

Haha. Rhey scambling. They have no idea what to do next. The XR is pointless. They could have simply lowered the price on the original X to $750 and dropped the A12 into it and they didnt even have ro have rhw XR at all. But they were too busy trying to be greedy. At least with the X, they would have had a better display and cameras. Apple is s scrambling, because their sales usually go up during holiday season, and instead they are going down. Oh well. Lets see what the fans gotta say. I dont feel sorry for them. Both Apple and Samsung is gonna feel a pinch. But at keast Samaung isnt trying to rip people off You can get an S8 for less than the XR and get a better looking phone, with better cameras, higher ip rating, fast charger, premium headphones and all rhe adapters needed in the box. At least Sammie is offering a bit more for thw price. Looks like they may sell less than last year. But still make plenty because if gross overpricing.

23. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

"at keast Samaung isnt trying to rip people off" Are you talking about Samsung - the company with a higher gross margin than Apple?

71. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

They sell more products than Apple. So having a higher gross margin is expected. Also Samsung sells 300M+ phones every year and sell other products too. Samsung numbers are not just phones.

75. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

But, if Apple is ripping people off, doesn’t that mean that Samsung - a company with higher margin - is ripping its clients even more?

79. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

No. And I answered as to why. Again here is what you aren't looking at. Go and look and price first how much it costs to make an iPhone vs an S and Note. Now to be fair, rrcwny the S and Note have costed slightly less to make vs some latest iPhone models. But not by much. Samsung usually charges roughly 60% on retail. Example. It cost Samsung $380 to make the S7 edge. They sold it for $750. It costed Apple $220 to make the iPhone 6 series that they sold for also $750+. Typically 1st party parts cost more r ok make, because Samsung makes most of their own parts. But since Samsung electronics owns the company that makes most of the parts, then obviously in some cases they will pay a than what they may sell them to another company for. So like Apple paid more for the X display vs the Note 8, even though they were very similar. Then you next need to consider features and capabilities. How is Samsung ripping people off? Compare the Note at $1000 vs the latest iPhone. There are at least 100 things I can list right now that the Note 9 has better that make it more worth the price. But I've said it, the Note 8 and 9 both should have been the same price as the Note 7. I don't see $250 I'm additional benefits. Yes it has more storage, more ram, improved cameras, bigger display, premium headphones and fast charger and so much more. It certain holds far better value that justifies $1000 vs any other brand. Even the Pixel is not worth what Google wants for it. Please just look at the full package. Not just the phone, not just the features, not just the accessories and capabilities. Look at all of it together.

84. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

Oh, I see: you have absolutely no idea that the “gross margin” is the difference between the price of products, paid by the customer, and the price, paid by the manufacturer to build those products (incomes-ctb). Which means that - on average - 1000$ Samsung phone is cheaper to build than 1000$ iPhone. Google gross margins are even bigger than Apple’s. Which means that there are Android manufacturers that are ripping people more than Apple allegedly does.

83. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

It is not the level of margin, it is what you get for the money you spend. Compare a flagship Galaxy to a flagship iPhone and it is clear which is better value, the Samsung. The Note 9 and iPhone 10s Max is a prime example, better design, much more packed into a similar sized phone and superior overall package in favour of the Note.

85. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

iOS is worth 10k$ for some people. If you can’t get it on the Note, that means even iPhone 7 is a better value than any Samsung device. We have different definitions of the word “value”, but this article is not about either of them, it is about the production costs and the fact that some Android manufacturers are “ripping” people off more than its users think.

87. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

The article is not about production costs at all, nor is it to do with Android manufacturers “ripping” people off. It is about this years iPhones selling far worse than expected. Value has cropped up in the comments as it is a likely reason for this. Customers do not consider the gross margin of a product in the "value" judgement at all, most will not have a clue what that is. While "perceived value" is real, there is also a general view of value and comparing a Note 9 with an iPhones XS Max is a good example. One of the main reasons the latest iPhones are not selling is the brand premium one pays when buying an iPhone has become too high. In a market that is stagnating both in demand and technological advancement, increasing prices to the current level, with little, if anything being given in return is proving too much for Apple consumers.

88. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

The article is not about production costs at all, nor is it to do with Android manufacturers “ripping” people off. It is about this years iPhones selling far worse than expected. Value has cropped up in the comments as it is a likely reason for this. Customers do not consider the gross margin of a product in the "value" judgement at all, most will not have a clue what that is. While "perceived value" is real, there is also a general view of value and comparing a Note 9 with an iPhones XS Max is a good example. One of the main reasons the latest iPhones are not selling is the brand premium one pays when buying an iPhone has become too high. In a market that is stagnating both in demand and technological advancement, increasing prices to the current level, with little, if anything being given in return is proving too much for Apple consumers.

90. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

Do I look like I give a fk about Apple’s sales?! I don’t, dude, let them plummet, if the products are not adapted for today’s market. I was just saying that, if Apple is “ripping people off” with the prices, than Samsung or Google are even bigger “thieves”, because for their phones the difference between the price to sell and the price to build is even higher.

91. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

One of my points is that the difference between the price to sell and the price to build is not necessarily a factor in there being a rip-off. Investment in efficient production processes and investment in tech, as Samsung does, costs money and lots of it. Expenditure that is huge and not included in the gross margin. Apple spends far less on research and development compared to other leading tech companies, including Samsung and sell phones that are less well specified. Their products are certainly not the most durable (despite Apples lies), are more expensive to repair and require a lot of extra expenditure to provide functionality that comes as standard on many phones costing far less. This is why an iPhone just is not good value. How does it get away with charging more for less? It has a monopoly with IOS and sales are supported by staggered payments. You do care about Apple otherwise you would not be alway defending them on topics like this. You can so a lot of good things about Apple products, that are good value, especially recent iPhones is not one of them.

92. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

Let's see if you are right or wrong. 1. "Investment in efficient production processes and investment in tech" - every product is being made using and every server that is hosting X's services runs on renewable energy - every piece of paper used is from its own forests and the company X is taking good care of the forest - the way the devices are designed, they need less resources (like less RAM or smaller mAh batteries). 2. "Expenditure" - X is paying the biggest price for some components - the cost to build X's devices is the highest 3. R&D - according to a statistics site, X has spent $11.6B, while Y has spent $3.7B more (we should consider the fact that X does not build it's components, it only invests in how should the components work, software, services, security etc). 4. "Their products are certainly not the most durable ... are more expensive to repair and require a lot of extra expenditure to provide functionality that comes as standard on many phones costing far less." - X phones have 6y support - a 5y old X device is still capable to compete with last year's mid range device from Y - if you want X to pay big, you can't expect to have cheap phones to repair... 5. "This is why an [X phone] just is not good value." - my 5y old X phone is worth 50€ more than Y phone that costed the same to purchase; my 2y old X phone is worth 170€ (which is 56% more) more that a 2y old y phone - I can break the screens on both and I still get a better deal on a X device (with Care, I can break the screen twice, with my insurance, I can break it 3 times) - Premium care: for X base phones is $12/mo, including theft or loss (for the top tier phone is $14/mo); for Y phones (only 3 are eligible) it is only one price $12/mo but you don't get theft and loss coverage; [with my carrier there is the same price, but it's good to know the offer of the manufacturers] I let you guess which one is Apple (hint: it is not Y).

93. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

Yes, thank you for proving me correct, with a reply that is mostly misguided and irrelevant to the point at hand. Point 1. Pandering to the "eco-friendly world" is not an efficient production process or an investment in tech. Point 2. So Apple does not manufacture its own parts and has to buy in products from its competitors like Samsung. This backs up my investment statement (if Apple put more into research it would be able to produce the latest technology itself, rather than buying it in). It also backs up my value statement as Apple cannot provide the same value as a company that designs and manufactures a lot of its own parts. 3. If you do your research properly you would know Apple is behind Microsoft, Amazon and Samsung if R&D, yet Apple fans love to boast about them being the biggest company in the world. If Apple invested more it could provide more value in its products. 4. Software support has nothing to do with the durability of the hardware. Indeed in Apples case the so-called software support gives a good chance of bricking or fatally crippling your expensive hardware. I would have to pay much less to repair any of my phones even though they are expensive and better overall products than the Apple equivalent. Apple purposely designs its products to be difficult to repair and controls the repair process so to make more profits. This is poor design and yet another reason iPhones are poor value. 5. Throwing out what you may get by selling your phone in the future if your phone with built-in obsolescence and poor durability survives is not a value argument. Take the upfront cost + cost of repair + premium on accessories and maintenance less a marginal return if you sell it and value does not exist if you want the full picture. Having to pay for very expensive insurance and then pay towards any repairs is not value, it is a rip-off. Getting more for what you pay upfront, cheaper running costs, less chance of needing repairs and it being significantly cheaper if required IS better value. So you see clearly I am correct.

95. Leo_MC

Posts: 6935; Member since: Dec 02, 2011

1. the second part of your statement was about "investment in tech" and I have shown you that Apple invests in tech. 2. Apple is (and has always been) a DEVICE manufacturer, it never built and sold parts so why should it start now? Walmart does not do agriculture, does not (or I think it doesn't) pack the food, it just sells it; UnitedHealth does not produce drugs, they just buy and use them to cure people; Berkshire does not print money etc. 3. learn to read before you just go on and say something. 4. you should see how "crippled" is my 5s (btw, I should sell it)... Again, "expenditure" dude, you can't expect Apple to pay the highest prices for the best parts and their phones to be cheaper to repair than cheaper phones with cheaper parts. 5. The XR costs me 270€ (it was 670, I subtract 400 - the value of my 7 - and I get the final value I pay for that phone), which is under 12€/mo within a 2y period; a S would have costed me 10€/mo, but I can live with paying the difference. Insurance costs me the same for every phone, so my "costs to repair" are identical; accessories are indeed more expensive, but guess what, I use a Samsung made charging pad (with an iPad power adapter) and my bt headphones work the same with every phone I own (better on iPhone, because of the chip inside)... So, absolutely nothing you have said about Apple is correct (except the R&D investments): it invests in tech (did you know that it gave LG money to modernize it production lines, it has a lot of money invested in part manufacturers - those dudes that made its graphic cards, Toshiba, to name a few); it pays a s**tload of money for parts and services (more than any other manufacturer does); its devices - with some exceptions - are of great build quality (see XS and Max water tests, drop tests, burn tests etc) and last more than other phones; the products are more expensive to purchase but more cheap to own on the long term. It sure isn't the only company that does great products, there are different products that proved to be better, but overall, when you get an Apple product, you get a great one with the best support and ecosystem.

96. wickedwilly

Posts: 640; Member since: Sep 19, 2018

1. You are pretty dumb if you think I or anyone thinks that Apple does not invest in tech. The point you are avoiding is it spends far less than its peers, while having a bucket load of cash sitting doing nothing. So you have shown me nothing but your ignorance. 2. Wrong, Apple is not a device manufacturer. It designs the devices overall, buys parts to fill it and writes the software. Its products are mass produced and mainly manufactured and assembled in Asia. Nothing you have said here can counter my point. 3. It is you that have reading comprehension problems. Do you deny Apple spends less than those companies on R&D? 4. You are extremely naive if you think Apple does not overcharge for repairs, the parts themselves are nowhere near the cost they buy them for. The cost of replacing the back cover alone is much more than the costs of the whole phone new. The repair quality is also very poor and third-party repairer if they can get the parts, will do a far better job. Yet another pointless and desperate reply. 5. Your XR cost you 750 dollars if you bought the base version in the US plus taxes, plus the insurance you took out. So well over 1,000 dollars. You do not know how much you will get for it, if you can sell it. If it gets broken or stolen you will have to pay up to 229 dollars per occurrence. So it is not costing you 12 dollars a month even if it is not lost, stolen or damaged. So everything I have said is correct and you have given nothing to prove otherwise. Advancing money to LG (whose screens are not in the same league as Samsungs) does not lead to better tech, just a cheaper source of lesser quality screens. iPhones have never been the most durable and were way behind in ingress protection and Apple has admitted to built-in obsolescence. Even in the support world, Apple are poor worldwide, just look at how they deny obvious flaws and blame everyone but themselves.

37. rouyal

Posts: 1573; Member since: Jan 05, 2018

Desperation looks like Samsung making a folding phone.

72. strategic_developer

Posts: 1627; Member since: Jul 17, 2018

They are making something different. The price shows they are not desperate because it will be priced out of reach of the vast majority. It is likely aimed at enterprise and business customers. Not everyday people. But youre so desperate to spout your crap, you didn't even think of that.

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