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Snapdragon S4 Pro with Adreno 320 graphics is the first to top the new iPad's PowerVR GPU

0. phoneArena 16 Aug 2012, 04:48 posted on

For the first time we have something else than the new iPad on top of the GLBenchmark test, and it is an LG E970 device with Snapdragon S4 Pro and Adreno 320 GPU...

This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 04:51 12

1. Non_Sequitur (Posts: 1111; Member since: 16 Mar 2012)

S4 Pro will kill EVERYTHING. Except OMAP 5, that should be good.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 04:57 7

2. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

not if TI dont handle their business lol

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 05:04 4

3. bobfreking55 (Posts: 866; Member since: 15 Jul 2011)

Exynos 5 too.

ARM15 and 1080p is da future!

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 05:09 3

4. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

yea.....the far away future lol

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 06:06 7

9. pokharkarsaga (Posts: 385; Member since: 23 Feb 2012)

Snapdragon Krait = ARM Cortex A15
S4 PRO APQ8064(Adreno 320) =Quad Core Exynos Cortex a15(Mali T604)
S4 PRO MSM8960T(Adreno 320) = Dual Core Exynos Cortex a15(Mali T604)
This benchmark should be compared.
Still Exynos is the winner in benchmarks.

Snapdragon Krait is the carbon copy of ARM Cortex A15.See this link below:-


posted on 16 Aug 2012, 06:21 3

10. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

yea but once again that chip might not be out til around the end of next year for all we know......Qualcomm is going to be the standard chip until then....S4 is doing too good right now

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 08:03 7

15. SuperAndroidEvo (Posts: 4847; Member since: 15 Apr 2011)

Yeah like I said Qualcomm is the most complete SoC out there. They are the only chip makers that have it all, POWER, PERFORMANCE, & USABILITY. Their chips can be used in any network in the world & they benchmark better than anything out there.

Qualcomm S4 Krait Pro is the BEST chip out there. ARM A15 dual-core is STILL missing in action & once that gets released Qualcomm will drop the S4 Krait Pro quad-core. Looks like Qualcomm is a head compared to Samsung, & Texas Instruments in their chip development.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 12:33

33. dmckay12 (Posts: 243; Member since: 25 Feb 2012)

Both of the Pros are quad core. The MSM chip is clocked higher than the APQ chip.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 13:05 1

43. KParks23 (Posts: 627; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)

The msm pro is a duel core chip set and the apq is quad core bro

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 14:16

55. dmckay12 (Posts: 243; Member since: 25 Feb 2012)

Your right. Sorry.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 15:06

62. KParks23 (Posts: 627; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)

No need to apologize lol its cool

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 15:42 2

67. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

the Snapdragon IS NOT an A15...

i dont know who keeps telling you that, but you need to stop listening

Qualcomm calls it an "A15" equivilant.. which it most definitely is not. Its slightly better in chip design than an A9, but it is nothing close to an A15.
Notice how the S4 is well below the A9 exynos 4412 and just barely beats out the T3 in most tests?

An A15 would laugh at all 3 of those chips.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 16:24 1

79. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

"A15 equivalent"

what does the word equivalent mean?
(rhetorical question)

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 16:28 1

83. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

it means its a MARKETING TERM. like "nearly new pre owned".

In real life, it means squat when it cant even keep up/ahead of the A9's

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 17:10 2

88. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

which A9's is it not keeping up ahead of?

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:12 1

90. cheetah2k (Posts: 1584; Member since: 16 Jan 2011)

WTF remixfa?? Are you smoking crack?

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:29 1

91. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

nope, just looking at benchmark after benchmark that proves my point.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:34 1

92. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

explain to us which A9's its not keeping up ahead of...

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:35 1

94. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

exynos 4212/4412. It's barely ahead of the T3 in some tests and behind in others. All which are A9.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 19:13 1

99. XPERIA-KNIGHT (unregistered)

but the S4 dual is better than the Exynos dual and the S4 pro is better than the Exynos 4412 right?

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:44 3

96. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)

The current Krait v2 is a halfway between A9 and A15, like the Scorpion was a halfway between A8 and A9.

Krait v3 apparently makes the final jump to either equivalent A15 perf or just slightly faster.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:46 1

97. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

krait v3. the pro? its the same chip with a new GPU. Thats the only difference. The Quad version is the pro with 2 extra cores. They are using the GPU to pick up the slack from the CPU. you might get a 20-30% real life performance boost from the extra 2 cores for floating point operations and such on the quad.

calling the chip itself "half way" is pretty generous since it cant even top A9s. At half way to A15 it should at least top A9's or ride with the exynos in its current form.
Also, the S3 was most definitely not half way either.

posted on 16 Aug 2012, 18:59 2

98. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)

Nope, Krait v2 is the CPU in the Pro, which is exactly the same as the original MSM8960s. Krait v3 is still yet to come, and will bring IPC increase and higher clock speeds.

It's pretty accurate because I don't see dual core Cortex A9s slapping an MSM8960 around, when it takes quad core Cortex A9 SoCs to equal an MSM8960.

The Snapdragon S3 was half way, it was somewhere between a Cortex A8 and a dual core Cortex A9. Which puts it right about in the level of Tegra 2 or so.

posted on 17 Aug 2012, 09:46

105. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

yea, but here's the difference. True A15's slap quad A9's around. the E5 is going to run circles around the E4 quad. If the S4 cant even keep up with the E4, how can it be a "half way" between the E4 and E5.

Besides, it doesnt "take a quad".

The apple A5x chip is a rebranded E4 DUAL (exynos 4212) with powerVR GPU, and its been the current benchmark champ for all commercially released devices. The only challenger has been of course the E4 Quad in the SGS3. So the theory of "only because they are quad" is bunk.

posted on 18 Aug 2012, 01:07

110. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)

The A5x isn't a rebranded Exynos 4:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_A5

Intrinisity, the company that Apple acquired for SoC design, located in Austin, TX. Conveniently, Samsung's biggest semiconductor fab is also in the same place, and it is dedicated to Apple's SoCs. What a strange coincidence.

The Snapdragon S4 doesn't keep up with the Exynos 4 Quad because of GPU and higher internal bandwidth needed to feed 4 CPUs. A dual core Kraitv1 will get slapped around by any Cortex A15 SoC, any Krait v2 quad core SoC will be equal to Cortex A15 SoCs, any dual core Krait v3 SoC will equal any Cortex A15 SoC.

I know you hate Qualcomm, it's fine. Don't kid yourself though, they are far from ceding performance to their competitors. Exynos may be the fastest, but it doesn't matter when even the mighty Samsung must put away the Exynos and pony up for Qualcomm SoCs to be able to supply their biggest markets. You might not care about LTE, but I'm sure you'd care about DC-HSPA+, and both require a Qualcomm SoC to work. I can tell you right now that many people I talk to refuse to ever go back to 3G, so their only answer is Crapdragons. Even if it isn't, like in the iPhone 5, a Qualcomm modem will be in the heart of it.

Take your crusade somewhere else, Exynos is far from the god of the market.

posted on 19 Aug 2012, 09:24

112. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

what a strange coincidence that the A5x also mirrors the Exynos CPU nearly bit by bit with a different GPU.

Yes, we all know about intrinsity. Samsung also got the original Hummingbird/exynos designs from them. Apple bought the company to get legal rights to the designs but they are still bound to samsung through contracts. The iterations from the original hummingbird/exynos have all been samsung upgrades to the design. That includes the A5/A5x.
Its an exynos with a different GPU (a better one).

Im not some crazed fanboy. I dont "hate" qualcomm. I call it like it is. Period. Dont throw in your emotions into my arguments.

When most people think of 3g they think of slowrizon and sprint's 3g which is..... very slow.
3G goes up to 12mb/s on GSM, unlike the 2mbs on CDMA.
I'm fine with 21mb/s HSPA+ and exynos. The rest of it is bragging rights. Your phone cant do anything wit the extra speed anyways. If you dont tether often, u have no real need for HSPA+42 or LTE other than to NOT be on VZW 3g. Hell, I'm still running my 3g 7.2mbs SGS1 and am fine with its regular speeds of 4-6mb/s in testing. Internet is fast, google music streams HD without a hitch, Netflix works perfect.. why do I need LTE again? However a real world bump in horsepower will give me more access to the newer games and features that this phone cant handle. The Adreno 225 is such a marginal upgrade to the PowerVR found in the SGS1 its not worth the money to upgrade. $600 for a 10-20% performance improvement in GPU (yes the cpu is obviously a bit faster, but i dont have cpu issues as it is).. no thanks.

But that's just me. Some people are convinced they need it. Its like saying you need a Shelby 500hp mustang to get to work every day when you never go over 65mph. It would be fun, but its not needed for 95% of people.

posted on 19 Aug 2012, 20:04

116. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)

By your line of thought, what a strange coincidence that the OMAP4 is just the Exynos 4210 with a slower GPU. I guess Samsung also designed the OMAP4. Two Cortex A9s at 1.2 GHz, definitely Exynos right there.

Apple is bound to Samsung for their semiconductor fabrication, not for design. Apple clearly does not want to have Samsung also controlling their designs when they are now huge competitors in the mobile space.

You're not a crazed fanboy, but you have a bias. It's not a bias where you explicitly reject everything Qualcomm, but you prioritize CPU/GPU performance above all else, and you put Samsung on a pedestal when really they're just a market juggernaut that got to their position through aggressive pricing and economies of scale.

It's fine if you're willing to stay with HSPA+, but I know that I'm not. HSPA+ is far too variable and latency is far too high. When it is completely possible that HSPA+ can only deliver 1 Mbps on the downstream and 150 ms latency, I know that I want LTE. Even 9 Mbps and 70 ms latency is a massive step forward, and makes it completely possible for me to do things like online gaming on the go.

The Adreno 225 is slightly faster than the SGS2's Mali 400, which still isn't fast enough for me. You may not care about increased performance, but I do. It's not about what is needed, because no one needs a smartphone. Just looking at the desktop space, no one needs more than a Pentium 4, but the market marches on. My needs changed. I went from an Athlon 64 to a Core i5 2500k, from 2 gigs of RAM to 8. Why did I go with such a jump? Because I started using web browsers much more intensively. My old computer cannot handle 200 tabs in a browser, this one can do it with ease. I would've never predicted my usage patterns becoming like this, but they did. That's why I never say never to more CPU, GPU, RAM, and DL/UL speed.

posted on 20 Aug 2012, 08:40

121. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

1) your argument makes no sense. Ti has their own tweaks to their base ARM architecture.
They are bound to Samsung for design and fabrication. SUPPOSEDLY that's supposed to change with the A6 chip which is supposed to be pure Apple, but we havent heard a peep about that in a long time. The A4, A5, A5x chips are all Samsung upgrades to the chip except the GPU.

I dont have a bias. No company pays me a dime to have a bias. I just want "the best" that I can get. I compare each generation amongst itself and figure it out through reading data sheets, various articles, and bench marks. If the E5 and Pro were doing a side by side and the Pro beat the crap out of the E5, I would give total recognition to Q and poke fun at samsung. However that just hasnt happened yet. So far each generation has been consistent with Sammy and Ti taking first and 2nd and Qualcomm and Nvidia battling for 3rd and 4th. Thats not bias.. thats just reality.

I think you mean 1Mbps upload. Its capable of 82mb/s download at its current max if it were to be implemented. Yea, 21/42mbs is plenty fast. I can play Diablo 3 on my computer with my 3G SGS1 tethered and its faster than my crappy DSL connection im forced to have.
I stick with GSM for now because there are a thousand more phone choices, the plan is WAAAAAAAAY cheaper through Tmobile, and the mod community is exponentially larger.

The Adreno 225 nearly/about as fast as the Mali400 in the SGS2, but in most tests the over clocked Mali400 in the SGS3 blows it away. Check those off screen tests for non FPS limited runs.

Anandtech benchmarks never lie.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5868/htc-one-s-revie w-international-and-tmobile/3

this is the newer version of GLBenchmark. There is an issue in some of these tests though with exynos that needs to be patched by the dev though. Still gives a good indication on the tests that do work.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6126/glbenchmark-25- performance-on-ios-and-android-devices/2

for reference, here is how the Exynos stacks up against the Pro in Vellamo, which is of course Qualcomm's home grown benchmark to only test the parts that make them look good (well known, not fanboy, look it up lol). The Pro beats the E4 quad, but not by a whole lot.

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph6112/48700 .png

Also, while looking at Anandtech, I came across this prelim OMAP5 benchmark that Ti did with the GL2.5 bench that I linked to a sec ago. It just barely edges out the A5x in the Ipad3. Of course the OMAP isnt ready for prime time yet like the S4 Pro obviously is, so we will see how those scores progress. Again, no scores count until its on a retail bought phone. Prelim benchmarks are not to be trusted.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5892/ti-shows-off-om ap5430-gpu-performance-before-computex

posted on 20 Aug 2012, 08:58

122. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)

1. I wasn't claiming that OMAP is designed by Samsung, but under your very loose interpretation of who designs semiconductors, that's what you'd be claiming.There's a difference between being bound to a company because they're the only ones with enough fab capacity to support you, and having the company actually design it. This is just like how TSMC does not design GPUs, Nvidia and ATI/AMD do.

2. Of course no company pays you, but you don't need to deny that you have a certain bias in the way of what you focus upon. It's perfectly fine to have one. I'm saying that you cannot weigh the worth of an SoC purely upon it's CPU and especially the GPU.

3. I didn't say the max theoretical download rate. It is completely possible to see 1 Mbps on HSPA+ on the downstream if you are using your phone during a time that other people are actually awake and loading the cell tower. I can get 10 Mbps on my phone using HSPA+, but it's worthless when the only time it happens is at 4 in the morning. Oh, and T-Mobile's DC-HSPA+ can only be reasonably expected to hit 10 Mbps or so, and peaking up in the 20 Mbps range. Yes, it doubles if you have DC-HSPA+ 84, but that takes spectrum that almost no one has, and uses up more battery than the equivalent LTE solution. HSPA+ is on it's way to becoming a legacy network for circuit switched fallback and basic data. LTE should be for HD voice and true broadband internet speeds.

4. Sure the Mali 400 in the SGS3 destroys the Adreno 225, but I have yet to see anything that even comes close to challenging the GPU of the SGS2. It's fine as a stop-gap, and the fact that the Snapdragon S4 brings integrated LTE baseband, GPS receiver, WiFi, Bluetooth, GSM, and WCDMA all in one makes it a far better solution than Exynos, especially in the US where there's currently a huge movement towards LTE and DC-HSPA+.

posted on 20 Aug 2012, 13:29

123. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)

I rarely ever get less than 2-3mb/s during peak downtime in the middle of a large city. Like everything, it all depends on where you live. I know VZW peeps that rarely see double digits on LTE and have never seen 20s.
Tmobile's 42mb/s regularly gets in the teens and 20s in real world speed tests. Dont know where you got that. According to the last PC mag test, VZW just barely edged them out on a national scale. And at less than half the price of a VZW plan, I can live with that.

Actually HSPA+84 is more spectrum efficient than LTE that peeps are currently using. Tmo will soon have LTE 10, which will convert to LTE-A (which is more spectrum efficient than HSPA 84) with a software upgrade, and it will have 42mb/s to fall back to. So it will be super fast with a side of fast... and it will still be half the price. The only reason Tmo decided to drop HSPA+84 which was supposed to launch in 2012/2013, was that peeps were demanding LTE so they are caving to market pressure to make sure they can use all the right code words for advertisement.
GSM is going to be a legacy network... in like 10 years. That's not something I'm worried about for my next upgrade.. or the one after. VZW is going to start to try to phase out CDMA in 2015/2016 depending on how fast they can cover their entire spectrum in LTE. CDMA is the legacy, not GSM lol.

The SGS2 and SGS3 use the same GPU so I dont understand your statement. The mali400 in the SGS3 is just over clocked compared to the mali400 in the SGS2.

Yes, integration is the better solution which is Q's only real edge on competition since they OWN that tech. Since they wont cross licence its keeping others from being on the same playing field. They need to watch out though, if everyone else cant figure out a way to implement good integration without stepping on Q's patents, there will be lawsuits to force those patents into FRAND. Thats great for us as consumers but really bad for Q since that is their biggest leg up on the competition.
Had the exynos 4412 had good LTE/HSPA+ integration there would not have been a chip switch out for the american version just like with the SGS2. That is a lot of lost sales for Q

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