It's not stealing when Apple does it, because it wasn't stealing when Google did it either
0. phoneArena 13 Jun 2013, 16:17 posted on
Every time there are new features announced for iOS, there is an uproar around the web about Apple "stealing" features. I have talked before about why I think this is a silly argument, but I wanted to put up a refresher on the idea, because the claims simply won't die out. Here's the simple reason: it's not stealing when Apple does it, because it wasn't stealing when Google did it either...
This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here
6. TechWorld_Observer (Posts: 15; Member since: 17 Aug 2011)
Remember the first iPhone? No really innovation as there were many features already on contemporary phones at the time, but Apple was able to put the top features from each phone into the iPhone, not real innovation, right? simple, any company COULD do it, but never did. Worst thing about it is that these other companies knew about it and yet they wanted to keep selling junk. Yes, you remember, ugly designs, buggy software, gosh you had to keep messing with the software features all the time (if you could) just to get your phone to a satisfying point.
A TV screen, an existing circuit board, a few other existing components, they just put them all together into one product... the PC. All easy, right, no true innovation at this, any boy could do this in their parents garage.
What's the lesson here?
206. Sauce (unregistered)
Last time I checked there still are ugly & hideous designs, buggy software, as well as still having to mess with the software to get your "awesome" phone. This is why I left android for windows and iOS.
7. RORYREVOLUTION (Posts: 3104; Member since: 12 Jan 2010)
Everyone knows that every company in the world "steals/borrows" from their competition, they make it better and improve on it, advance it as much as possible. Nobody has a problem with that, we have a problem with the fact that Apple has stolen ideas from the very start and then had the nerve to try to ban and sue the hell out of their competition when they themselves are no better.
But sure, we can pretend that Apple isn't a money hogging billion dollar corporation that steals from their own developers and takes the credit for themselves and tries to bully and scare competition right out the door.
9. biophone (Posts: 1910; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Michael mentioned that. Apple hasn't started any lawsuits under Tim cook. That was a jobs thing and he isn't part of apple anymore.
85. Stuntman (Posts: 835; Member since: 01 Aug 2011)
That is true, but many people still see Jobs as the face of Apple and still remember those lawsuits while he was running the company. I don't know how long it will be before that perception changes.
125. roscuthiii (Posts: 2180; Member since: 18 Jul 2010)
Until the current cases are resolved most likely.
And then of course there has to be no new anti-competitive lawsuits filed.
134. biophone (Posts: 1910; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Yea I agree the perception hasn't changed but the point is that it should! This is based on cook's statements (against lawsuit) and actions (hasn't sued anyone)
197. tedkord (Posts: 10233; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
Her also hasn't dropped any lawsuits, and had expanded existing ones, while continually claiming that others are stealing from Apple. Just recently Apple filled to have the GS4 added to existing suits.
Tim Cooks hands aren't clean.
14. TechWorld_Observer (Posts: 15; Member since: 17 Aug 2011)
Isn't that what business it's all about? Take what you can and leave nothing behind? Do any of us really think that it wouldn't be same with any other company being in Apple's shoes? Please! As far as that goes, How many of us being in Apple's shoes wouldn't do the same?
It's like they say: "It's nothing personal, just business"
24. RORYREVOLUTION (Posts: 3104; Member since: 12 Jan 2010)
The thing is, I would actually be excited for IOS7 if Apple weren't the biggest hypocrites in the world about it.
198. tedkord (Posts: 10233; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
No, I don't think it would be the same, because no other company had an entitled, petty tyrant like Jobs at the helm. Most companies are run by adults.
10. cse.vicky (unregistered)
Its good inspiration I should say ! Every OS and Hardware gets inspired by every other one, this helps everyone to reach a standard [very important]and also leads to innovation to make them different from rest of the lot !
12. Anti-Troll (banned) (Posts: 64; Member since: 12 Jun 2013)
Its good to get inspired by others.. but how about getting inspired, copy it , patent it and sue others! Haaaaa!
29. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
When was the last time Apple sued a company that wasn't already suing them?
51. ZeroCide (Posts: 768; Member since: 09 Jan 2013)
As it goes Apple sues, company counter sues.
52. LionStone (Posts: 724; Member since: 10 Dec 2010)
That's all well and good but it wasn't too long ago and while there are still ongoing cases it's hard to forget even though some want to forgive. Good article.
61. MCrapp (Posts: 318; Member since: 07 Apr 2013)
What about A.pl.......http://thenextweb.com/apple/2012/09/10/apple-reportedly-suing-polish-online-supermarket-trademarking-name-a-pl/
92. MartyK (Posts: 777; Member since: 11 Apr 2012)
This is just plain crazy!..what do you have to say to this Mikey?..smh
94. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Name issue, not a patent or feature issue. Every company stops companies that infringe on brand names.
15. Feanor (Posts: 670; Member since: 20 Jun 2012)
I don't entire get the argumentation of this article. We don't blame companies for copying obvious concepts from the analogue world or even from each other; we blame them for copying very specific and distinct features. E.g. there are many ways to unlock a lockscreen but initially many manufacturers were copying Slide to Unlock from Apple one to one. In the same way, a notification bar makes sense for every smartphone, but Apple did copy almost one to one the Pull Down bar from Android even if this is not a necessary prerequisite for an operating system to work. Even in hardware; Samsung had many interesting designs (like the Wave which was distinctly Samsung) before the iPhone debut but after the iPhone success they "orientated" the design of the first Galaxy S to a design suspiciously similar to the iPhone design. And Apple in turn seemed to get "inspired" by Sony designs for the iPhone 4. Maybe the whole story about who is copying whom is exaggerated but not entirely unfounded.
19. RORYREVOLUTION (Posts: 3104; Member since: 12 Jan 2010)
"E.g. there are many ways to unlock a lockscreen but initially many manufacturers were copying Slide to Unlock from Apple one to one."
Apple did not invent slide to unlock.
31. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Exactly, I had slide to unlock on my Sony laptop back in 2000.
59. Seymur (Posts: 19; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)
I slide to unlock my door for years. should I sue
97. MartyK (Posts: 777; Member since: 11 Apr 2012)
Now do you see why it's important that tech site correct Apple on the spot, so lost soul like Roryrevolution will know the truth.
fyi it was Neonode N1m..that show off the slide to unlock
80. Googler (Posts: 813; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)
Correct, but they did sue Samsung over it, and that's the entire point of why so many people hate Apple.
95. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
That was also under Steve Jobs years ago. If you're gonna hate a company, find a more recent example.
100. MartyK (Posts: 777; Member since: 11 Apr 2012)
But if Tim want to end/drop the lawsuit he CAN, right?
211. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
We have no idea whether or not Tim Cook can stop the lawsuits. It's not just his decision anymore, because Samsung would have to agree to stop as well, and since Samsung has been winning more recently I don't know how likely that would be.
108. Googler (Posts: 813; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)
Recent as in the case is going to be retried a second time, even after both sides were told to work it out? Tim is proceeding with the case, it's still recent.
116. Stuntman (Posts: 835; Member since: 01 Aug 2011)
I would like for both parties to work it out as well. As much as I would like to see the law suit dropped, I doubt that will happen. By the time this gets settled, I will probably upgrade my SGS3 to something else.
128. Googler (Posts: 813; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)
I would too, as well as all other generic lawsuits negatively impacting the mobile world. Unfortunately because Apple was so draconian in forcing bans, I don't see Samsung forgiving them and coming to mutual terms any time soon.
161. timcooked (Posts: 5; Member since: 13 Jun 2013)
Because we copied people, yes we admitted.
199. tedkord (Posts: 10233; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
Neonode had slide to unlock before Apple. And, if Apple wanted to defend their interpretation of slide to unlock, thats fine. But Apple doesn't roll like that, so in court they claimed that a tap is just a zero length slide, so tapping a button to unlock infringed their patent. Apple believes it owns the concept of unlocking a phone.
16. dmakun (Posts: 312; Member since: 06 Jun 2011)
Nice article Michael. I still have to frown at Apple though because they took the moral high ground by litigating competition who like them built upon existing technology. One thing I'm glad about is that they (apple) are now clearly following android and learning a few new tricks along the way.
18. turk_az (Posts: 39; Member since: 11 May 2012)
why didn't you write an article like this one when apple was suing everybody for copying and stealing ?
is it alright when apple dose that?
26. maxican16 (Posts: 364; Member since: 29 Sep 2011)
Actually he may have. But the lawsuits make apple unbearable. So I hope everyone calls them out for stealing because of it.
88. Stuntman (Posts: 835; Member since: 01 Aug 2011)
Better late than never. I guess I was out of line when I criticised you for not publishing your other article when Apple was suing everyone. My apologies.
20. TruPatriot (Posts: 110; Member since: 27 May 2013)
The thing isn't that they do it, it's that Apple is a hypocrite. They sue an entity and then turn around and do the same thing they just sued for.
33. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
When was the last time Apple sued a company that wasn't already suing them?
54. ZeroCide (Posts: 768; Member since: 09 Jan 2013)
As it goes Apple sues, company counter sues.
69. MCrapp (Posts: 318; Member since: 07 Apr 2013)
A.pl........Yes I know that funny!!!!!!! Even more funny than the rectangle!
72. saffant (Posts: 271; Member since: 04 Jul 2011)
Uhh.. Samsung? Apple sued first.
Also, the difference lies in the fact that Apple copies ideas (like most companies), but then they try to patent it, and then claim it as "innovation". I don't see you mentioning that point. Also, that analog amplifier picture doesn't compare cuz its UI is not a touchscreen.
Apple also copies DIRECTLY from their competitor which is really just sad.
96. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Yes, Apple sued Samsung first, and that was two years ago while Steve Jobs was still in charge.
Are there ways to do notifications or quick settings better? We're so early in the smartphone world, that there's no such thing as copying, companies are simply figuring out the best way to do things. There are limited design options with the hardware available today.
21. techaman (unregistered)
the problem is they take the same idea from everyone else that's already deleted see if there's sooo everyone else don't give any credit to anybodyI know most of the stuff came from whether last phone because I had a palm and previous phone before that and I love those phones nobody ever recognize is where all these things come from but you cannot compare computers and filing cabinets to a cell phone
34. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
And Google and Microsoft always give credit, right?
90. Stuntman (Posts: 835; Member since: 01 Aug 2011)
I don't expect any company to come out and announce new features and then say whom they stole it from. The presentation was targeted at current and potentially new Apple users. To these people, these features are new and will be available if they have or buy Apple products. People who won't buy Apple products will not be swayed if Apple starts giving credit to other products whose features they incorporate in their own products.
22. Technobri (Posts: 84; Member since: 10 Dec 2012)
Apple had no choice but to do this in order to stay in the game.
23. nicholassss (Posts: 368; Member since: 10 May 2012)
its less what they present and more how they present it and also how iOS users interoperate what they present.
Apple presents a feature new to iOS and users tout its as being brand new to the world.
35. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Not really. Apple presents features as being new to its users, which they are.
79. chaoticrazor (Posts: 2347; Member since: 28 Aug 2012)
actually id say android users are the first with the ''innovation'' line to mock iOS users
all im taking from this article is everything is inspired by something else and built upon. just when apple do it too many start the childish crap when google do it there praised......double standards
91. Stuntman (Posts: 835; Member since: 01 Aug 2011)
Yes, it is childish, and many Android users will use the "Jobs started it first" argument.
200. tedkord (Posts: 10233; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
Actually, when Apple does it, rabid Apple fans claim they innovated it. I have seen people right on this site claim there were no tablets before the iPad. They've insisted Apple invented multitouch. That no phone had a grid of icons before the iPhone.
And the other difference is, when Apple borrows, they try to patent what they borrowed and exclude others from using anything even remotely similar.
25. daymler (Posts: 12; Member since: 09 May 2012)
the first review from phone arena about ios7 was all about how the ios7 is nothing new, about the childish colours and about the lack of innovation. and when i saw the review i was like "finally a true review without stuff like - ios is s*itty but so do android so we cant judge " - guess what people - we can judge !! and without the advertising iphone is nothing (the most recent iphone is with DUAL CORE CHIP?!) because the advertising of iphone is all about how the phone is making your life better and people that have more money than sense think that it will make them happier?!. and since the first ios7 review all the following articles about the os form phone arena are all about how ios7 is good like android 4+ (w*f?!) and its soooo funny how thay are trying to convince us how ios7 is not so bad...its bad...its very bad...its like os for dumb people...no for average customers - for stupid customers!! because there is nothing hard to understand or confusing in android 4+ !! and last but not least ios 7 vs android 4 - 7 ios versions and nothing new except a new look (w*f?!) vs. 4 android versions (only 3 for smartphones) and innovations, new designs and more and more with every release !!
36. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2700; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Wow, good to see you have an objective opinion...