Intel takes a look at 5nm chips, already in the foreseeable future
0. phoneArena 14 May 2012, 09:51 posted on
If you look at the mobile industry, ARM designs and chips dominate the scenery with 28nm being the keyword for this year with Qualcomm’s Snapdragon S4 leading the pack, but looking on the other side of things…
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3. remixfa (Posts: 13935; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
now if only they could match their ability to smash physical barriers with some good drivers. ahhh dreams.
There was an interesting article on anandtech about the generations after Ivy Bridge and how they are going to try to converge with mobile like tablets and such. PC's will soon become boutique items as more and more people move to laptops, tablets, ultra books and the same, and they basically think they can get a 1 chip to rule them all solution in a generation or 2. If they can do that, the generational leap in performance from say an A15 to that.. will be exponential.
Now where the heck is my 3D holographic displays? lol
12. Penny (Posts: 1193; Member since: 04 Feb 2011)
There are a lot of predictions surrounding the replacement of PCs by mobile products, but I'm not too sure. If the next generation mobile processor is the equivalent to a modern quad core processor in a desktop, then a next generation desktop could always just use multiple of those mobile processors.
In other words, the physical constraints of a mobile device will always ensure that it is less powerful than it's larger (and less space-restricted) counterparts. And, as long as that remains true, there will always be enthusiasts that opt for the power.
13. remixfa (Posts: 13935; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
thats very true, thats why PC's will be botique if all holds true. I doubt they will ever go away. To power nuts and gamers, the PC will always be the main rig... but to the masses, i can see PCs slowly fading out of main use. It sure as heck isnt going to be instant.
Take windows 8 for example. Say you get a tablet at whatever size you like that has one of these neat 11mm intel chips in it. The integrated GPU configurations they were talking about for these chips were pretty substantial so for most uses, they will be pretty well equipped.
Now say you want to type a document.. you take that tablet, and throw it into a keyboard doc, similar to Asus Transformer's... inserting it into the doc auto flips the screen into desktop mode.
There is also no reason that those keyboard docks cant have a DVD drive, or any other host of ports.
Basically your tablet is also your full notebook which is strong enough to replace all but the most enthusiastic builder's PCs, and unlike modern laptops has a great battery life.. again like a transformer in its dock.
When that becomes reality, I think we can all safely say the PC rig as it exists is going to become a rarity.
14. belovedson (Posts: 832; Member since: 30 Nov 2010)
some of the problems with this is. the keyboard and mouse function from a pc can't be replaced anytime soon with the hand scrolling features from a tablet.
actually let me take that back the mouse feature will probably be non existent starting from the new xbox and the second generation motion sensor.
the keyboard in the other hand can't be replaced. the tablet equivalent just sucks ass. i really dont like the chicklet style of a keyboard either.
17. Penny (Posts: 1193; Member since: 04 Feb 2011)
You're quite possibly right remix. I agree with pretty much everything you said except for how scarce the desktop might become. I personally think it will take a hit, but nothing more than maybe 20-30% over the next 7-8 years. Then again, my custom-built desktop and I are admittedly biased =p.
I think the biggest impediment to that change is that a societal shift toward touch-only devices require a significant cultural change. We are clearly undergoing that process, and smartphones have greatly accelerated it, but I see a bigger change in technology that is really going to be needed to make that cultural shift. I think the change that will really shift the culture around technology is when it is all around us, when we are basically living in an augmented world. Walls act as touchable surfaces and you take pictures by doing a hand gesture with no device in your hands. You don't really carry around a smartphone, but rather just an access point that you can instantiate anywhere you are.
It's vague, conceptual, and pretty off-topic, but I like it lol.
22. remixfa (Posts: 13935; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
You would love MS's internal development studios. Digital paint and holographic touch sensors abound.
I didnt mean that PC's would die over night. I also think it will take some time as most people keep their rigs like 3-5 years before replacing if not longer. 20-30 sounds good.. maybe even up to 50% in that time frame.
I'm already thirsting to build a SLI setup with those new GeForce 690 (which would technically be a quad setup, since the 690's are dual 680's per board), so I know I'll be a long time hold out for PCs. :)
The tablets/laptop hybrid as described would solve the touch interface transition as it would be touch only w/ live tiles as a tablet, and allow a keyboard/mouse and desktop mode when docked. Since all the power is in the tablet itself, it would truely be the best of both worlds. And as described it would make the transition from mouse to touch incredibly easy.
It really astounds me that we havent made the transition decades ago. I remember when I was a kid, I had an adult friend that worked in computer tech that was running the OG Liesure suite larry in monochrome with a touch sensor on the monitor.. and i could control that through touch.. other than having to type in certain things. "Ken sent me" :)
Yea, touch screens in the 80s and early 90s.. why hasnt the transition happened already?
4. Bluesky02 (Posts: 1439; Member since: 05 Dec 2011)
That's some serious news.
Like remixfa said Intel need some good drivers. Though i can play Crysis 2 on Intel HD 3000 without any lag.
15. belovedson (Posts: 832; Member since: 30 Nov 2010)
i think intel is intentionally not providing good driver support and they essentially lock down all the features that allow us to customize, hack, overclock the cpu/gpu as in years past.
sandybridge essentially killed most of the convenient modding that was always available with intel chips. if you want to mod you have to pay for the higher chipset, it's annoying. but intel forver, amd can suck it
5. keron (Posts: 11; Member since: 28 Mar 2012)
can anyone tell me what's the main difference among the 32nm,28nm,23nm etc.....& what's the benefit of less nm chips.....
7. maxican16 (Posts: 363; Member since: 29 Sep 2011)
Google can. Essentially it comes down to less power needed to process the more tightly packed, and therefore more efficient (i.e. faster) transistor arrangement.
11. nb2six (Posts: 298; Member since: 27 Apr 2011)
The main difference is with the smaller maufacturing process, you can generate greater power, and less energy consumption all within the same amount of space of a chip with a larger processing size. For example the leap from a 32nm process to a 14nm one will approximately almost quadruple the processing power all the while using a quarter of the energy.
8. x7black7x (Posts: 118; Member since: 19 Feb 2012)
so whose the boss
(intel inside arm outside)(lol)
i can see the BOSS getting pissed off run arm based chipsets
10. Bluesky02 (Posts: 1439; Member since: 05 Dec 2011)
Smaller size chipset mean
: less power consumption
: less heat
: reduce cost of chip
: greater revenue
It means that one day you can have true PC like processor on your smartphone and tablet(already possible) which will allowed you to carry heavy tasks like playing high end HD games e.g Crysis, Battlefield 3.
16. belovedson (Posts: 832; Member since: 30 Nov 2010)
people keep talking about the capabilities of tablets and smartphones but any real gamer will game on a high rez lcd screen at 23-29 inches of screen real estate and not on some puny 5 inch to 10 inch high rez screen.
unless your talking about gaming as in stupid games that require you to throw a creature at a stick building, or pacman esque type game, or some other weaksauce game available for tablets and smartphones
18. pbui.818 (Posts: 78; Member since: 06 Feb 2012)
What could happen is an evolution in software design on the operating system front and on the game front which results in something compelling on a mobile device and eliminates the need for a keyboard or mouse especially in the domain of content creation. The next feat would be a huge revolution in battery capacity.
Once those things happen, the fixed desktop workstation ceases to have an advantage over the mobile device.
There will forever be a niche market for desktop PCs but the advantage won't be essential to the broad market. Once the industry surpasses the 10nm threshold, we'll be able to do most everything on mobile devices like tablets.
I love the ASUS Transformer Infinity as a transition platform. And a 10 inch screen is a design limitation that can be overcome with pico projectors which emit (3D?) 4K or 8K displays. 7nm or 5nm would allow this so we'd just need the huge battery capacities (or omnipresent wireless induction charging).
I haven't even considered the potential of a "Google Glass" styled display.
Work on the software design!!!
19. pbui.818 (Posts: 78; Member since: 06 Feb 2012)
What comes next?
21. pbui.818 (Posts: 78; Member since: 06 Feb 2012)
0.7nm = 700pm
0.5nm = 500pm
0.33nm = 330pm
0.22nm = 220pm
0.15nm = 150pm
0.10nm = 100pm
By then, of course, we'd hit some quantum physics boundary that electrons would leak all over the place.