How is Apple Maps any different from the Android G1?
0. phoneArena 06 Oct 2012, 09:55 posted on
Apple Maps may be a bad product now, and it may not have lived up to the flowery language that Apple used to launch it, but aside from the big announcement, how is it any different from Android 1.5?...
This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here
63. Hemlocke (unregistered)
Google Maps is FAR from the benchmark. Nokia has a commanding lead on Google by virtue of data collection. Google collects millions of miles a year, whereas Nokia collects billions of miles a year (~3 billion) via USPS and FedEx.
72. Stoli89 (Posts: 333; Member since: 28 Jun 2010)
I'm not sure how exclusive those contracts with FEDEX and UPS are, but I think with well over 100 Billion in the bank, Apple will be a welcome addition at either or both companies. But these mapping processes at Nokia Navteq go well beyond UPS/FEDEX. The later are more for validating data and/or identifying issues. Nokia's NAVTEQ teams have been mapping the globe for years with specially designed vehicles, similar to Google in some parts of the world. The recent Atlantic article about Nokia Maps gives a good idea about how much catching up is in store for Apple in this area.
128. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
If I were getting paid by Apple, I wouldn't work here. (Plus, not sure why they'd pay me to repeatedly say that they released a bad app...)
4. Mxyzptlk (Posts: 10056; Member since: 21 Apr 2012)
Apple gets complaints unfairly for trying something new but google does it and it gets love. Google maps was not perfect when it came out
30. darkkjedii (Posts: 19157; Member since: 05 Feb 2011)
Sure wasn't, in fact it gave me headaches. Over the years it got great though, and so will apples. It's funny how some people won't acknowledge that.
34. PowTheBowl (Posts: 86; Member since: 19 Apr 2012)
Apple didn't even tag their maps as "beta" and if Google was Apple, they would say "It's still not perfect" or "Still needs improvement", unlike Apple that they will say "The most advanced and powerful mapping service out there" without even comparing it with Google Maps.
44. Berzerk000 (Posts: 4270; Member since: 26 Jun 2011)
Of course it wasn't, but Google didn't call Google Maps the most powerful mapping service when it came out. That's the big difference. if Apple would've just stamped a beta tag on it would've been fine in my book. But they didn't.
52. jroc74 (Posts: 5967; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)
I bet if Apple Maps was labeled as beta.....this article probably wouldnt have been published.
129. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
probably not since in my last article that's exactly what I said Apple should have done
61. protozeloz (Posts: 5395; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)
but when it came out maps where a novel thing
73. Stoli89 (Posts: 333; Member since: 28 Jun 2010)
But the consumer hadn't already been exposed to a decent mapping experience. This is Apple's real problem.
84. iphoneisthebest79 (Posts: 70; Member since: 23 May 2012)
you are right, it was a huge step from apple to create her own maps, with time it will be better.
105. tedkord (Posts: 9692; Member since: 17 Jun 2009)
When you advertise it as "the most powerful" and other superlatives, it had damned well be better than the alpha crap they released. Add to that all the Apple loyalists who constantly proclaim that Android puts out buggy betaware, while Apple only puts out refined, polished product that just works, and you've got the formula for ridicule when what they put out is pure garbage.
It's that simple.
5. cepcamba (Posts: 717; Member since: 27 Feb 2012)
That's what I've been telling my co-android-using-friend, he's been bashing the iOS maps 'til kingdom come like most people. The map is bad...so? Get a different one. If there's something you can do about it then it's not really an issue specially if it's as easy as downloading another app.
Anyway, Michael yo! Thanks for this weekend article! +1
8. android_hitman (unregistered)
wow!!! nice article .. thank you
14. ajac09 (Posts: 1480; Member since: 30 Sep 2009)
"Have you ever noticed that Google always gets the benefit of the doubt simply for trying something new, but if Apple tries something new, and doesn't come out with a perfect first attempt, it is deemed an utter failure? We've covered this phenomenon a little bit here and there, but we've never really focused on it completely, and we'd like to give that a shot right now (and as always, bring some perspective to the woefully myopic fanboys in our readership). "
above is from an obvious isheep. I love how they are comparing the old and the new. They always seem to do that when it comes to the iphone. They can never compare it to the new only the old. G1 was a start and was the begigning but apple has had plenty of time to make IOS maps much better then they did. They half assed it because they knew isheep would accept it.
27. RamyRamz69 (Posts: 390; Member since: 12 Dec 2011)
That's because everytime Google outs a product it does not call out "The best blah blah blah blah blah blah ever"
16. phljcnth (Posts: 478; Member since: 30 Apr 2012)
Would it sound bad if I say Micheal seems to be condoling with Apple Maps developers?
113. Droiddoes (unregistered)
No, he ALWAYS defends and sides with apple. I don't think the kid would know 'objective journalism' if it punched him in his iMouth.
17. devildlm1 (Posts: 71; Member since: 12 Sep 2012)
The fact that they still had one year on the contract and decided to ditch Google maps anyway was part of the reason why I have been so critical in regards to Apple maps. I actually admire all mobile OS companies, Google, Apple Microsoft, RIM etc... , The only reason I lean more towards Android in comparison to iOS is simply because of their misleading marketing.
The reason why "Apple haters" can't seem to grasp the fact that Apple uses such extreme superlatives to describe their products is because a large percentage of Apple fans still claim that iOS is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Yes everyone is entitled to their own opinion but a lot of them are not even aware of what the competition has to offer
25. devildlm1 (Posts: 71; Member since: 12 Sep 2012)
For example, when I show my iOS friends the features of my GS3, they are either astonished at how extensive android is in comparison to their iPhones, or say that its too complicated for them... which i totally respect
18. PowTheBowl (Posts: 86; Member since: 19 Apr 2012)
I think (IMO) the reason why people get disappointed when Apple tries something new and fails is because Apple exposes their new things too much and users will expect that it's flawless and perfect. Google in the other hand doesn't expose much when they try something new and they also put a beta tag, when it's fully baked then it's time Google exposes them to many users.
50. jroc74 (Posts: 5967; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)
I agree. Look how long GMail was labeled beta.
21. Firedrops (Posts: 249; Member since: 06 Sep 2011)
Unfair comparison. Back when Google launched it's Android 1.5, there was no Android 2.3 to compare it against, no amazing prior experience to realize that it was terrible. iOS was pretty much the benchmark, but for users who wanted an open system, that was comparing apples to oranges.
Apple certainly took a right step by introducing their own maps, but they did not handle the launch well. Period. They could have pushed the maps back another year, to refine it to the point where Google Maps are now, and pack it into iOS7. Or more logically, allow both Google Maps and Apple Maps as options, and incrementally improve Apple Maps until it was satisfactory, instead of waiting for the yearly iOS update.
26. ajac09 (Posts: 1480; Member since: 30 Sep 2009)
back when google launched it map programs was almost unheard of and you had to use your carriers which was expensive and as bad as IOS maps is right now. PhoneArena just compares it this way because its the only thing they can find good out of it. They are some of the worst jouranlists out there. I wish they would change the name of this website to IphoneArena so most of us know to avoid this website. But since they post ONE none Iphone article a day vs 5 iphone articiels a day sometimes you find a diamond in the rough.
51. jroc74 (Posts: 5967; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)
Have to agree with this. Look how long Apple has been doing OS's. Android was like brand spanking new.
I also get what Michael is saying about why do it when there are other mobile OS's out there.
Bottom line, Google held back features for the iOS version, Apple wanted a map app with more features. Apple had to either make their own or partner with someone else that would hopefully include all the features of their maps app. IMO...Apple did the best thing. No need to worry about if someone else will do what Google did. IMO...Apple needs to start using the word beta more....
91. MartyK (Posts: 743; Member since: 11 Apr 2012)
I think the problem wasn't Google holding back feature to iOS, because they could had ask Google for permission to edit it/refined the software.
The problem was simply Apple Arrogance Mentality; You see, thru out Apple mobile history ( with the help of the media, listen up PA) Apple feels it could not do anything wrong.
Example, PA is talking about the Mapping issue, what about the Wi-fi issue?, Camera issue?.
So the media (and people who loves Apple) strategy is to summons the Mighty Android/Google name; which btw it's getting old...
28. Reverence (Posts: 224; Member since: 16 Jul 2012)
apple maps r new....google didnt role their maps as perfect maps.....things take time for development and i am sure apple will improve and might become the best because they are recruiting many former men from google maps...they will become awesome but for now its Google
33. andro. (Posts: 1997; Member since: 16 Sep 2011)
The g1 was years ago when smartphone were in their very infancy and android had not been previously available,any phone anywhere more advanced than a feature phone was a marvel to behold. The maps at that time were a huge new feature. Nowadays smartphone have progressed exponentially and Google maps is highly evolved. At this stage every smartphone should have this advanced mapping,the whole point with the apple maps fiasco is they removed these maps in a vendetta against Google,put in its place a substandard error ridden alternative and claiming that it was the most advanced and beautiful maps ever created. While the g1 mapswere entirely accpetable in their day it is totally unacceptable for a manfacturer of the worlds so called most "premium" and expensive phone to launch with such a substandard level in 2012. The ultimate factor in the apple maps situation is apple acting further in its childiah tirade against google while trying to get away with a shoddy map replacement to its ifanatics
41. darkkjedii (Posts: 19157; Member since: 05 Feb 2011)
Don't make excuses it. His article was on point, google improved over time, and so will apple. Android users don't give apple excuses so don't make any up.
53. andro. (Posts: 1997; Member since: 16 Sep 2011)
Its not excuses,yes apple maps will improve with time,but it will take a couple of years,and while its doing so apple will still claim its maps are brilliant and its smartphone offer premium features. For the pricing and the tech level in 2012 apple tries to claims its has this is unacceptable.
Its like for example if apple had a vendetta against camera module manufactuers and decided to create its own. It puts a 1.3 mp 'apple camera' in the iphone 5S and claims it makes takes the worlds best smartphone photos. In actuality the photos are of poor standard and have artifacts. Yes you can claim the camera module is in its infancy,yes it will improve from here over time,yes the camera module might be at a level similar to the ones in phones around the time of the g1 but this is unaccpetable to have in a so called 'worlds best premium smartphone experience' in 2012. (iphone faulty purple tinted photos aside lol!)
130. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Can we ignore Steve Jobs' "thermonuclear war" BS? Even if Jobs had never said that, Apple and Google are in direct competition. Would you give Microsoft s**t for not using Google Maps on Windows Phone? How about BlackBerry for not building in Google Maps?
This is business. It's a competition. And, you don't give the competition a prime spot on your home screen.
147. ilia1986 (unregistered)
No. We can't. It's not what Steve said, It's what Cook does.
No company in the history of humankind in the consumer electronics business was so keen on destroying it's rival that it managed to get it's (rival's) products banned, and it (the rival) to pay it 1 billion $. No company but Apple. They started it. They did all this. They caused all this patent trolling lawsuit BS.
Their actions will never be forgotten - and their image will always be that of the company which banned Galaxy products just because they could compete with their own ones.
This isn't business. This IS thermonuclear war. This is a war between Android and Apple. Cook could stop the snowball when Steve died - but he didn't.
35. RevKBA (Posts: 11; Member since: 29 Dec 2011)
Another article from Phone Arena basically saying "Yeah Apple came out with a complete failure of a product, but let's deflect over to this flaw with Google/Android."
Comparing a feature Apple released this year to a feature that was on a phone that was released FOUR YEARS ago, regardless of how big a project it is, is completely asinine.
39. whysoserious (Posts: 318; Member since: 20 Jul 2012)
"Now, try to imagine what Apple Maps will look like 4 years from now."
I imagine... a map app that's as good as today's Google Map, named iMap. Tim cook will call it "revolutionary," iFans will believe it and we, Android fans would laugh at it and say "we had that four years ago" and enjoy a much better Google map app.
54. andro. (Posts: 1997; Member since: 16 Sep 2011)
Its always the case.To use a sci-fi quote : "all this has happened before and will happen again"!
42. Berzerk000 (Posts: 4270; Member since: 26 Jun 2011)
"Apple wasn't trying to recreate Google Maps on the first try, it was more likely just trying to build something that was "good enough" for users,"
That's bull. They were going directly after Google and Nokia Maps with this. They called it the "most powerful mapping service ever." That is a direct jab at Google and Nokia. But then they later took it back after they realized how much they screwed it up. They didn't use the Apple exclusive comparisons like they usually do, like you stated, which was the main reason that everyone made such a big deal out of it.
Of course, I don't think anyone expected Apple's Maps to be the greatest maps ever. But to mess up THAT bad? If it was really that bad in the first place, why release it? I thought they had another year on their contract with Google, why would they release a product that is so terrible it is hardly usable, when they could perfectly well wait another year, use a superior service, and use that extra year for development?
We all know Apple Maps is going to get better in a couple years, but the main thing I have against it is that Apple is better than this. I can't remember whenever they released such a bad product (if they ever did), why are they screwing up so badly. And to market a product that they KNEW was terrible out into the public, and call it the best thing ever, is just wrong.
Yes, the Maps is going to get better just as Android got better. But it was their initial execution of the product that bothered everyone, not the product itself. It was a first time deal, and everyone would've calmly accepted that this wasn't going to be the best, until Apple told them it was. Then, everyone was disappointed, and that caused the ruckus all over the interwebs.
If Apple would've just said at the first moment, "This is not a complete product. We intend on working on it and improving it in the future." Or even just putting a simple "beta" tag on it would've been sufficient. But no, they had to go and tell the whole world it was the best, and the backtrack later on.
179. dragonstkdgirl (Posts: 144; Member since: 07 Apr 2012)
Why release it? Hmmm. I can see the conversation leading up to Apple maps....
"Okay guys, now the boss wants us to release this map app that we all know is substandard, so I figure if we just use the same colorful language to describe it that we do for the iPhone and iPad... 'revolutionary.....best ever.... truly innovative...magical' then Apple users will maybe believe it. If not, we will show the proper regret, apologize, and they will see we are now taking responsibility for the app instead of saying 'You're holding it wrong.' Win win either way."
Never been so glad to be an Android user, I hate getting lost. I'll keep my Google Maps, thankyouverymuch.
45. iami67 (Posts: 318; Member since: 18 Oct 2011)
Worste article Ive read in a long time. Dont know whats worste the writing or the whole story in general. When the g1 came out the maps system was new and was in beta saying there might be bugs and people expect that with it being new. Apple comes out years after tons of great map systems are available and claim this is the newest greatest best way to map and deletes all the good maps on you then they fail horribly. thats the diference sir. get your facts.
46. MartyK (Posts: 743; Member since: 11 Apr 2012)
Q."How is Apple Maps any different from the Android G1?"
Q. Apple Maps is no different than Android 1.5.
A. Huh?, Excuse me, you are comparing an Application to a Company first attempt at a Operating System?.
They took other companies ideas and knowledge put them together and call it theirs.
Now they are trying to be a real inventors, and THEY FAIL!!
Now you want to blame us about their failure, and comapre them to a first Generation Operating System, please give us a break...hahahaha
65. Hemlocke (unregistered)
Android wasn't created by Google, it was purchased. So, by your reasoning, Google took another company's ideas and knowledge, put them together, called it theirs (Android 1.5), and it was a failure. The G1 did not sell particularly well, if you recall.
131. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
All I'm saying is that both products are first gen products.
49. breathlesstao (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Apr 2010)
So, Apple uses superlatives to describe its product again, when this time it actually is a piece of crap - and it's a wonder they're getting burned? Yes, Google's own might not have been any better back when it started. As in, y'know, YEARS AGO. But nowadays, when both Google Maps and Nokia Maps are very full, very mature, very usable softwares (let's not even mention big 3rd party names), with lots of additional features to navigation, how can the world's most arrogant and shameless company release an app that looks like it's been stitched together from scraps of fabrics just a day or two before the release itself, and call it all kinds of superlatives??? You don't have to be an Apple-hater for this, it's pure common sense. Be an iPhone owner, even: you pay lots of money for your favourite's latest and greatest, only to find something in it that's virtually unusable - something you see your friend's "cheaper" and "noname" phone doing much better (or, actually, doing at all). Wouldn't you be at least annoyed? At least Google has the audacity to do tests and snap a damn "beta" label on its products (or keep their ideas in the Labs). Not Apple, of course, because that's just not a road to walk for them, apparently. Well, tough luck then, but just eat what they cooked.
58. ilia1986 (unregistered)
"Apple haters can't seem to grasp that what is essentially nothing more than a marketing tool (the superlative) is not necessarily the benchmark for judging a product. "
The amount of people standing in line for every iDevice, most of whom don't care about anything other than the Apple logo - means that this marketing tool is not just a tool - it's a method to cause millions of millions of not-so-tech-savvy people go out of their way and out of their cash to buy the shiney iDevices.
So - if millions of millions of people believe that the iDevice is indeed magical, revolutionary, perfect, hyper advanced etc etc and swallow this marketing BS - they actually believe this TO BE THE BENCHMARK OF JUDGING THIS PRODUCT. And these people are NUMEROUS.
It's not so much about the tools Apple uses. It's how they influence the public opinion.
132. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
So what? The iPhone still has a 95% satisfaction rating.
What does it matter to you if other people buy an iPhone or not? It's their choice, not yours. If they haven't figured out yet how to do a Google search to research a product before buying it, let them get sucked in by false advertising. It doesn't make any difference in your life at all. It's their mistake to make.
We and every other website put out multiple stories on day one and even before the release saying that Apple Maps wasn't looking good. It's not like the information was hard to find.
148. ilia1986 (unregistered)
Yes. But you claim that if Apple claims that the product is "revolutionary, magical and amazing" - we - who hate Apple - can't possibly judge the product being as such because this is all marketing.
I say that because there are millions of people who actually believe that iProducts are magical, amazing and revolutionary (without any direct explanation) - and these sorts of people are those who flood the Apple stores and stand in lines weeks before the new iDevice is launched - this whole "magical, amazing, revolutionary" thing becomes the DE-FACTO benchmark for judging Apple products.
Yes, not everyone are blinded by this whole marketing thing - but many many many people are - and since no other company causes it's consumers to ACTUALLY BELIEVE despite reason and logic - that it's products are magical, amazing and revolutionary - this mind-washing mechanism that Apple uses causes us - free thinkers - to be greatly aggravated.
Remember the kid who sold his kidney for an iPad. Remember the robbers who robbed a supply of iPhone 5 phones. Remember all the media coverage Apple and iDevices get. People everywhere are fascinated by Apple - just for it being Apple.
I am a Jew. I recognize when the public idolizes something or someone so much so they don't care about anything negative about him\it at all. And I know that it could be dangerous. Just saying.
167. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Ah, of course, the most unbiased argument around, "No rational person could ever really like these products, it has to be trickery."
I totally agree that it is shameful how media organizations cover Apple like it's a "cultural event" (actual words used by an NBC News producer I know). Regardless of that fact, I'm sorry to break it to you, but some people genuinely like Apple products.
173. ilia1986 (unregistered)
Again, you misunderstand. It's not about rational people liking Apple products. It's about them liking Apple products for IRRATIONAL reasons. They just care about the Apple logo, or just about the fact that this is an iDevice and not something else.
177. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2696; Member since: 26 May 2011)
I think you're conflating two different parts of the process. People may buy an Apple product because the marketing claims that it is "magical and revolutionary", which could be construed as irrational reasons for buying a product. But, after they've bought the product, they like it because it works for what they need.
That's why the only people to get so angry at Apple are people predisposed to disliking Apple. If the marketing were really that far from reality, the people who bought Apple products would be upset all of the time, and Apple would fail as a company.
The fact is that whatever the reasoning for people buying Apple, once they've got it, they tend to like it, and at that point your argument is trying to take away something that people enjoy.
64. protozeloz (Posts: 5395; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)
I think there are two points to take on note Michael
The first point is time:
-When android was released it was slow and full of bugs, it was also using superlatives for promoting itself but it was competing with phones that weren't that good either, I can tell because I used Symbian WEBOS iOS WINMO 6-6.5 and the only one who would kill it was iOS yet iOS lacked stuff android already had on 1.5 so consumer lost something and gained something with android
-Now the new apple maps is released facing a competition that is simply blows away apple maps nearly every possible way even the weak Google Maps for iOS seems to do what most people came for, yet they release something that gives iOS users nearly nothing in exchange for a somewhat bad map experience. and they promoted it as some killing feature on the app, heck they even promoted Sisi Guided turn by tur navigation (as if it was different that regular turn by turn ), they are barely making an app to catch up while android was released with many standards
android was released in a transition time, google decided the project could not wait anymore and it helped them.. a LOT apple on the other hand was late to the party with its map solution and not only late late and with a horrible dress
when you go to the party on time you can go around with a crappy dress and people seem to mind less, especially if you are a class nerd, you now have time to put make up and look improved as the party goes on, but arriving to the party at its peak moment horribly dressed will get a lot of bad attention, especially when you are a top cheerleader... time is important
Apple gets the hook because they have portrayed themselves as the perfect, the clean, the better looking, the best, the one that "just works". google on the other hand has always been the lab guy the one beta testing stuff, people see that and underestimate Google's true potential (I think they do that on purpose) so when you underestimate someone's you are likely to get more surprised at normal performance. but when you have a self proclaimed top student doing a similar job and you had Overestimated him you become disappointed...
also you talked about maps beek worked for 7 years but you must also add that by the time it reached android it had already a huge database and lots of books, google maps started as a toy on your computer and kept evolving, by the time it was on your phone it could do more than the average GPS device. apple on the other side jumped right into the app without even considering giving people the chance to have both
74. brkshr (Posts: 9; Member since: 22 May 2012)
I've been following phonearena for at least 4 or 5 years now. You guys are getting pretty stupid with your articles now. Especially when you show your lsheep side. Comparing brand new technology to technology from 5 years is ago is just plain stupid!!! Un-bookmarking now...
Really!?!? & now I have to edit out Isheep... That just proves my point even more... F-off !!!
75. Jphones (Posts: 235; Member since: 10 Feb 2012)
Plain an simple apple put out a product that they knew yet again had major flaws that obviously come up in testing. They rushed it instead of making sure it worked properly. An are you really comparing 1.5 to apple maps? did you forget the iphone came out first so yeah they had a head start and still fell behind. stop making excuses for them. Better way to put it apple made a a car but forgot to put in a steering wheel and tires.
76. cobaltox1 (Posts: 8; Member since: 06 Jul 2012)
very simple...google is a where real inovation is!!!!!!!! apple is just a bunch of overated products and people thinking they are god!!!!!! why should they be measured with the same set of rules? POINTLESS
78. swap002 (Posts: 1; Member since: 06 Oct 2012)
Basically Google gets benefit of doubt because they intially don't say that their product is great or revolutionary. They don't hesitate to call it beta. Remember for how many years Gmail and GTalk were in beta states. They invite select users to test their beta products, take feedback and improve it. And that should be the policy followed by every company. Another example of it could be Nokia Betalabs. They make experimental products, everyone is allowed to test them and if everything goes right release it to masses. And if you pull the plug when it's in beta nobody cares. Apple certainly didn't follow the rule, at least it seems so. Instead of announcing Apple Maps with iOS 6 they could just release them after iOS5 as beta, ask users to provide feedback which for sure every single user would have done and continue till few days after iOS6 and then once the time is right make it go big.
Another thing is that Apple have already set people's expectations high and their own aims/standards too. Apple is supposed to release perfect product. Not some experimental product for premium price. If they don't do it, there's surely going to be outrage.