HTC claims it's still in the running for the next Nexus device
23. imkyle (Posts: 1071; Member since: 18 Nov 2010)
Nexus One was a turning point for Android. Galaxy Nexus showed what was improved for Android.
10. Dr.Phil (Posts: 1119; Member since: 14 Feb 2011)
Ok, I have to know: are you a professional troll? I have to applaud you for being one of the best I've seen on here. You first start talking trash about the Krait S4 chip being horrible after several people including myself have posted sources saying it is comparable to the performance of the Tegra 3 if not better in benchmark tests. And now you are on an article talking about the next Nexus device with an HTC avatar and picking Motorola over HTC. By the way, you also mentioned in a previous comment that you loved HTC phones. I just don't get it.
13. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
First of all I do like Htc phones but am I not aloud to like other phone manufactures as well. Second of all the reason I wan't moto to make a nexus device is right now they are producing phones with a huge battery as opposed to htc who right now their hardware isn't up to snuff. The reason I like HTC phones to begin with is sense so me wanting them to make a nexus phone wouldn't make sense since I would loose the thing I like most. I didn't say the krait S4 was horrible but its pointless for htc to change the processor to get LTE on a phone with lte in so few cities for at&t. I am sorry I am not a troll fanboy who just likes one company and will cheer for them no matter what. Sure I have prefences but I tell it like it is and if a company I like made a bad decision I am not going to praise them anyway. Stop trolling my posts because I am starting to get annoyed with this.
17. Dr.Phil (Posts: 1119; Member since: 14 Feb 2011)
Really? You never said that the S4 was horrible. Well why don't I point out a few quotes of your previous comments:
"And why would you rather have an s4 its less powerful and worse with battery."
"Second of all remixfa pa's eesident proccesor guru has already said the s4 is less power efficent and powerful then the tegra 3."
"Benchmark is easily manipulated. The snapdragon in t mobiles sgs2 is an example. Its obious the teg 3 is better it an equivalent cortex and has quad core. Plus you have to factor in the phone the proccesor is in. The resolution and skin come in to play."
"Ics uses quad core. The 28 nm vs 40 is offset by the five cores and quad core is more efficent in general then dual core."
"Without quad core this phone really isn't much better then the rezoned and I would take a droid razr maxx over this in a second."
Also, the size of the battery doesn't necessarily mean it will have a great battery life or not. And you also didn't take into account that the phone would be co-developed with Google, and I would think they would make sure the battery life was sufficient.
18. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Where did i say it was horrible? Nowhere. Thought so. Inferior to the tegra 3. Well it is that diesn't mean its horible.
Also when a phone has a 3000 mah battery its ussually pretty good in bat life. And considering the galaxy nexus doesn't have such great battery life having a moto battery will let the phone have a lte and have 2 day battery.
21. sgogeta4 (Posts: 394; Member since: 02 Feb 2011)
Actual power consumption of pretty much every ROMs/kernels including stock for the GNex bests the Razr. The only reason you get longer operating time on the latter is due to the larger battery capacity.
24. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Well the droid razr maxx has smart actions which can help but either way the fact they have such a big battery is really what I am talking about not consumption.
29. Dr.Phil (Posts: 1119; Member since: 14 Feb 2011)
Wow congratulations you are really good at this. You almost had me sort of angry. I applaud you. Once again you are calling the S4 processor inferior to the Tegra 3 without any sources to back up your claim besides what your mind is telling you. And now you are going on saying that as long as the battery is large, that means it will have a good battery life when someone just brought up the point that the Galaxy Nexus handles it's power supply more efficiently than the Razr. I just, I don't even know what to say. I just applaud you. You are really good at this. Better than I thought.
33. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Sources you want sources. How is this the s4 uses an a9 cortex equivalent and is dual core. The tegra 3 uses an a9 cortex and is quad core. They are clocked about the same. So therefore the tegra 3 is better. Benchmark can be deceived so using common sense is the way to go. This doesn't mean the s4 is horrible its not but compared to the superior international one x I think its stupid they changed the processor just for LTE.
The difference of power consumption is negligible but compare the galaxy nexus 1800 mah battery compared to the droid razr maxx 3300 mah that makes a huge difference in battery life. And yes they are about the same thickness even. That is why I want moto to make the next nexus. Not to mention if moto's next phone is a nexus it won't have motoblur the reason I don't like moto phones. But that also means that power consumption would be better. Google uses the nexus to point the manufactures in certain directions. This year they encouraged 720P screens and internal memory. Next year I want battery life being pushed by google. This has nothing to do with me having a vendetta against HTC.
41. HTCOE (Posts: 632; Member since: 20 Nov 2011)
AT&T made the decision to go dual-core LTE not HTC
43. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Most likely was a combined decesion. Htc had to make the phone you know. At&t is a horrible overpriced pos carrier though so the fact this phone is on at&t in the first place is its death blow.
56. BuckeyeCadet86 (Posts: 77; Member since: 26 Oct 2011)
The current s4 has dual core but there is a quad core s4 in the works. The Tegra does not have built in support for LTE so the power savings of the quad core processor are wasted by the inclusion of a separate LTE chip in the phone. The s4 dual core chipset has built in support for LTE and will be more energy efficient than the Tegra 3. Performance-wise the Tegra 3 will blow away the dual core S4, but when the quad core S4 comes out Tegra will be a thing of the past.
57. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Lets not forget buckeye an upcoming tegra 4.
32. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)
1. Not inferior to the Tegra 3, go back and learn process technology and CPU design.
2. It's sad to have a phone with over 3000 mAh of battery, which is something like 3 times the battery size of my Desire HD, not get past 3 days. My Desire HD manages to pull it off with a battery-sucking LCD screen and a 45nm Scorpion core.
34. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Ok the reason it doesn't get three battery life is lte. No other lte phone can last a day for a heavy user the maxx does easily. Thats impressive. The fact they can get a 3000 Mah battery in a such a thin phone is extremely impressive.
35. redrooster13 (Posts: 107; Member since: 20 Feb 2012)
Your desire can't last 3 days. Source: I own a inspire and use lots of different custom rooms and kernels. Never got past 1.5 days and that was not even using the phone.
38. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
He most likely never uses his phone lol.
Anyway I am going to quote remixfa who knows ten times more about processors then you guys:
Question was have they benchmarked the crapdragon.
"Yea, actually, it has.. at least by Qualcomm. And do you know which chipset they didnt show matching up against the S4 dual core? The T3 quad core. Thats because the T3 blows it away in performance. More cores, bigger GPU. They are not in the same category.
I realize your a big fanboy of HTC and all, but which would you rather have in your new $300 phone.. dual or quad core? especially knowing the quad core is in the international version
Looks like HTC is taking a page from samsung in keeping 1 phone with multiple chipsets in it. And thats not a good thing."
Then someone challenged him when he opens up his can of whoopass
"go look at that comparison. You will find lots of chips there, the T3 is NOT one of them.
the S4 is about 50% faster than the S3, which puts it just a smidge above an Exynos 4210. The T3 makes the exynos 4210 look old school in head to head comparisons.
Tegra3 4100+ on updated quadrant
Exynos 4210 3300+ on updated quadrant
(this link is actually showing an optimized sgs2 someone played with which is why the score is higher)
m/index.php?filter_model=al l&filter_benchmarkapp=Quadran t&filter_cpu=Samsung+Exynos+ 4210&filter_gpu=all
Quadrant still sucks as a real benchmarking app, but if the phones are not messed with, its still relevant to performance."
46. Dr.Phil (Posts: 1119; Member since: 14 Feb 2011)
PLEASE stop calling the S4 chip based on A9 architecture. IT IS NOT BASED ON THE A9 CORTEX. It is based on the A15 cortex (although a modified version if it). The Tegra 3 chip is the one based on the A9 Cortex.
The difference? The A15 Cortex has a 40% improvement in performance over the A9.
"The dual core 1.5 Ghz should beat Tegra 3 in most benchmarks, but also in real world use for most apps, especially those that are not heavily optimized for multi-cores."
Remixfa is wrong on this one. The Tegra 3 does hold an advantage in that it is the first quad-core chipset and if they do create applications modified to use those four cores then it will have an advantage, however in reality we aren't there yet. So yes, if you want to future proof yourself then the Tegra 3 chipset is great. However, my whole thing is stop going on here saying the S4 chipset sucks in comparison to the Tegra 3. There is no data to back up your claim whatsoever except when it comes to gaming in which the Tegra 3 does have a better GPU (but it only wins slightly).
52. KParks23 (Posts: 590; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)
U guys are back to this same old argument.. bio u should give the arguement up before u make yourself look even more foolish.. the t3 and s4 are.comparable the t3 is based off a a9 and the s4 is off the a15. Yes the t3 prolly has the slightly better gpu but processing power should be about equal or even a slight edge to the s4.. so please tell me how there not comparable when for the past couple days u been going around calling the s4 inferior when in fact its way more advanced than the t3 how can a duel core that's the equivalent of a quad core be inferior to me that sounds like a pretty big breakthrough... And not only that but again u keep saying these things without proof. how about posting a link or something to this sight where ur getting all this info from we can post links showing u how they compare but yet u keep saying the s4 is inferior with no proof of anykind.... Looks to me like someone does not like being proved wrong why don't u go back to the at&t HTC one x article so we can continue our conversation u ran away from on Monday??. Or do u still think HTC should make there own processors because huawei did lol .. when huawei are 15x the size and have 15x the assets that HTC does.
60. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
No proof really. The tegra 3 is quad core on a equivalent cortex and quad core is optimized on ice cream sandwich. Dr. Phil brought it up not me.
58. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Ok ice scream sandwich is multi core aware so most likely you will have this phone for two years its worth it to go for the quad core. It is really worth it on the the other hand to wait for the exynos quad core to come out though. Anyway I will leave it on the I won't argue with you on cortex because its an equivalent anyway and what its comparable too changes based on who you ask. Remixfa is very knowledgable about processors he works for t-mobile as a salesperson. Anyway I will be the bigger man here and call a truce I am tired of arguing with you and until the phones comes out all of this is just speculation anyway.
66. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)
The Inspire can last for an entire week if you don't use it at all. If you only do web browsing/texting, it lasts about 3 days if there is no partial wakelock issue and the fuel gauge doesn't get out of whack.
I've done more than enough tests, and general reports are that it drains 1% every 1.5 hours. That's just about a week of standby time if in a strong reception area.
55. willardcw4 (Posts: 169; Member since: 01 Oct 2011)
Based on @biophone's grammar, lack of knowledge, and constant sourcing of another user as 'fact', it's apparent that he lacks any sufficient background or experience in technology / engineering. He doesn't understand the concepts behind the technology and how various architectures and fab sizes change the performance of chips. It's not just clock speed. He shouldn't be taken seriously, so just ignore him. It's High School logic with nothing to back him up aside from @remixfa (which in this case follows the same lack of logic with his conclusions).
There is no point in arguing with him, he's trolling whether or not he realizes it. Let him have his opinion, albeit it there is no factual information to substantiate most of it.
The funniest thing he's said so far:
"Ics uses quad core. The 28 nm vs 40 is offset by the five cores and quad core is more efficent in general then dual core."
He hasn't been around computers enough to appreciate how substantial a shrink in die size is, whether it's a CPU or GPU. It's a huge deal and has massive implications on power consumption and PU efficiency. In addition, the number of 'cores' isn't relevant (for any type of computing device) unless there is software to take advantage of multiple cores / threads, or an OS that can delegate tasks to said cores / threads. Quad cores really only matter for a handful of video games in the mobile phone / tablet industry at the moment. In the coming years, things will shift towards quad-core, just like they are shifting towards LTE (and LTE Advanced, don't forget that calls will be handled over the LTE networks in the future).
Based on that fact, LTE is an equally (or more if it's in your city) important feature as a quad core at this point in time. LTE has battery issues, but the S4 is the first SoC to remove the need for an extra set of LTE antennas, a huge step in increasing it's viability in a smartphone from efficiency and power consumption point of views.
@biophone claiming that HTC should be making their own quad-core SoC's, since Huwaei is doing it, is also pretty laughable. He obviously has no grasp of the technology market or any of the major players. Ignore him.
59. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Not worth my time to respond to this in full here is a couple bullet points
-Htc should make their own processors relying on snapdragon will keep on putting them behind the competition. Its worth the investment. Or at least get prossecors from TI instead.
- Die size makes an impact no doubt but so does quad core
-When did I talk about clock speed
- You just said lte was important if it wasn't in your city witch is laughable. Add to the fact that most likely if your on AT&t it isn't.
61. willardcw4 (Posts: 169; Member since: 01 Oct 2011)
Last few points:
Being a 'salesperson' doesn't mean you have a good understanding of how things work. That's generally the opposite of a technical position (I'm an engineer, I know).
LTE is in my city (Las Vegas), and it's important because eventually (my guess is 2014) all data AND voice will be handled over LTE!!!!!! They are expanding their markets. Just because LTE isn't in a city doesn't mean it won't be in 6 months. Thus making it important.
I guess Qualcomm and Texas Instruments should just stop making processors and the phone OEMs should (based on your point about HTC). Phone OEMs for sure have a better grasp and more technological experience to build a great SoC over an electronics company with unsaid numbers of computer engineers at their disposal (sarcasm). Samsung makes so many products, as with Huawei, they have the tech and where with all to do it! That is why these companies have partnerships. Just like HTC partnered with Beats Audio. They don't have the ability right now to make a good and competitive sound technology, so they found someone that could. The customer benefits, not sure what the problem is.
Don't underestimate the S4 architecture, it's significantly better than the S3 and puts Qualcomm in a good competitive foothold against the other manufacturers.
62. KParks23 (Posts: 590; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)
And willard shows up bringing some knowledge nice... Not sure what bios problem is I guess he is 1 person that goes ahh durrrr 4 is higher than 2 thus making it better so let me troll and show how smart I am lol. I don't think u realize how much more advanced.the s4 is over the past s3 chips... The s4 will be just as powerful if not more and get better battery life by far compared to the t3 slight edge to the t3 with the gpu.
63. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
-granted the s4 architecture is better then the s3 but its still only a dual core and not on a15 level
- Qualcomm is doing a terrible job making processors. Honestly Htc should use someone else. Ti for example. Like the nexus did.
- With at&t most people won't be covered for a while their rollout has been slow.
-remixfa does know a lot about processors he has to sell the phone you know.
67. Hunt3rj2 (Posts: 396; Member since: 11 Nov 2011)
1. Where is your evidence? Anandtech and Semiaccurate say it's either just short, equal to, or better than A15.
3. Verizon also has LTE Androids, you know?
4. He's a salesperson, the other person is an engineer. I know who I'd believe more.
68. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
1) reference devices are not commercial. anandtech compared a reference device to a commercial device. Really,thats the beginning and the end of the argument until we see S4 devices in real life. The numbers they ran represent the "best conditions available" for the S4 in its current Adreno 225 state. That's part of what a reference device is for. Once manufacturers get a hold of it and tweak things for cost and bloat it down with Sense or Blur, those scores will drop quickly.
2) lol-Z! :)
3) What does that have to do with the S4 right now? so far the only S4 devices are GSM ATT and Tmobile devices, not VZW.
4) I am a sales person, and a tech enthusiast, and an amateur programmer, a gamer, an artist, a musician, a medical student, and I have years in this industry. Having one title over another doesnt automatically make you smarter than someone else. I read and study this stuff on my own time for my own pleasure as well as for work. I dont need to know all this extra junk for work (most sales reps ARE idiots after all), I learn it because I enjoy it and im fascinated by it.
You can chose to believe me or not, that is up to you. I have an earned reputation around here for knowledge in this stuff because I generally heavily research the topics that I talk about.
In the end, ill happily put money on it. When 2012 chips are all compared to each other (exynos 4xxx/5xxx A15 quadcore, OMAP5, S4 w/Adreno 320, T4 Grey), the S4 WITH the upgraded Adreno 320 will still be last place or slightly above the T4 at best. This S4 that you are arguing over now is junk and wont even be remembered come 2013.
Those Anandtech bar graphs look good, because its a reference design compared to year old chips in commercial phones, not to chips coming out this year. wooptie doo.
speak of the devil, here are preproduction units of the One X and S (T3 and S4 respectively) running benchmarks. The T3 has a much higher resolution to contend with and still manages to edge out the S3 in a good chunk of the tests.
Both phones need further optimization, but that whole "S4 is superior" crap just went out the window. I hate to rub your nose in "I was right".. but.. well.. ya know :)
3. 14545 (Posts: 1468; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)
Give it back to HTC. LG phones suck. I would rather Sammy or Moto have it over LG. I will for sure buy if it's HTC, but if it's LG I for sure won't buy.
12. 14545 (Posts: 1468; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)
That, and I'll never forget when my wife had the ally, and everytime it would update it would wipe the SD card.
4. Giggity (Posts: 147; Member since: 17 Nov 2011)
Why do I have a feeling Motorola will be the one to carry the next Nexus torch?
But if it comes down to HTC and LG, HTC got my vote.
14. Hmong_Xiong (Posts: 32; Member since: 28 Jan 2012)
I liked this because it has Quagmire on it :)
5. Leon101 (Posts: 90; Member since: 27 Feb 2012)
HELL YEA!! I want htc to do the next nexus cuz we dont want a high end nexus phone but made out plastic(SORRY SAMMY BUT I respect yuhhh) and also we want BEATS AUDIO on it d-__-b!!! Since the 1st nexus was the best i think htc should deserve a 2nd chance!!
22. sgogeta4 (Posts: 394; Member since: 02 Feb 2011)
The plastic in the Samsung is much better than HTC's crap. At least from my Nexus to Thunderbolt. And Beats audio blows. Software crap is far from any hardware DAC such as the Wolfson in the original Samsung Galaxy S.
7. N.Reynolds (Posts: 257; Member since: 15 Feb 2011)
Never liked LG Android phones, most likely won't like it if it is made by LG. Their Android phones just do not look good to me.
9. N.Reynolds (Posts: 257; Member since: 15 Feb 2011)
How ever I did really like the Nexus One. I really do hope HTC makes the next Nexus device. I think they could do a real good job with it.
8. redrooster13 (Posts: 107; Member since: 20 Feb 2012)
They better do a better job than they did with the One X.
44. biophone (Posts: 1923; Member since: 15 Jun 2011)
Thumbed you down by accident sorry. Anyway the international verison is fine. Expect the battery is not up to snuff. The at&t verison is the the bad one. Poor battery life hardly any lte service and and a crapdragon.
45. redrooster13 (Posts: 107; Member since: 20 Feb 2012)
yeah I'm on at&t. The main things I don't like about it is the relatively small battery that is not removable and the fact that it doesn't have a micro SD slot.
47. redrooster13 (Posts: 107; Member since: 20 Feb 2012)
Since att is never gets subsidized nexus phones, I'm hoping that moto will bring out the atrix 3 soon. It needs to have quad core and a battery like the razr maxx and unlocked boot loader would be nice. Also needs micro SD and removable battery.
48. theindianguy (Posts: 90; Member since: 30 Sep 2011)
That is not true. the at&t version has a S4 chipset with 28nm manufacturing so it's batt life would be comparable or better than T3.
53. KParks23 (Posts: 590; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)
I believe the s4 chip also has a built in lte radio the battery life on that phone should not be a problem. It's not going to be like the razr maxx obviously... But should be similar to say a droid razr with about a 2200 mha should be about the battery life u can expect with the new s4 chips advancements
54. KParks23 (Posts: 590; Member since: 13 Oct 2010)
Scroll down to cpu performance
11. gemini6991 (Posts: 24; Member since: 21 Sep 2009)
I'm rooting for HTC. LG phones just don't hold up well imo. It would be nice to give them the opportunity for a Nexus phone. But they need to come out with a solid high end phone first.
16. MNX1024 (Posts: 13; Member since: 16 Nov 2011)
HTC is definitely going to be interesting compared to LG. Especially due to their upgrade in the camera department. Heck, I guess I'll be fine as long as it's not LG. But, I would prefer it to be a Sony device though.
19. Luuthian (Posts: 240; Member since: 09 Sep 2011)
And have to deal with all their proprietary BS? Not going to happen now, if ever. Google values the openess of the Nexus line too much for that to happen. And Sony themselves wouldn't likely be keen on designing a device that didn't use Sony USB cables and memory cards exclusively, while also being filled with Sony bloatware.
Sony can make some great devices, but they don't have the mentality required to produce a Nexus branded phone.
25. MNX1024 (Posts: 13; Member since: 16 Nov 2011)
I have absolutely no idea what you're smoking. All of Sony/SE's Android phones uses microUSB. Phones that do have a memory card slots do use microSD. Seeing how their latest phone beside the Ion, have absolutely no memory card slot. Which actually is the route Google is taking with their Nexus device. I have absolutely no idea what proprietary stuff you're talking about concerning their Android phones.
Also, there was a rumor about Sony making the next Nexus. Therefore, anything can happen.
26. Cwebb (Posts: 501; Member since: 05 Oct 2011)
That's is what Google should pick based on
My guess: Is Samsung and Googlerola 50/50
Idk if HTC can live w/o Sense
27. doubler86 (Posts: 320; Member since: 26 Jan 2011)
LG has not made one quality android phone. I still remember hearing about the revolution and seeing Bing instead of Google, and the shock that was.
Samsung is the best manufacturer of 2011 (HTC was the best for android in 2010 by far) and even with all the new phones from HTC and LG I still see Samsung dominating in 2012.
28. kemjus (Posts: 32; Member since: 05 Oct 2011)
I hope if HTC makes it that they will use a super amoled screen! My roommates have the Rezound and Galaxy Nexus, at night the contrast ratio on the rezound looks horrible compared too the Nexus!
30. yougotkilled1 (Posts: 167; Member since: 27 Apr 2011)
I hope HTC makes the next nexus. Love the design of the N1 :D
39. metoyou (Posts: 279; Member since: 19 Oct 2011)
for some reasons I have a feeling that Sony not interested in making Nexus phone
36. jan25 (Posts: 470; Member since: 26 Feb 2012)
both Samsung and HTC will do an excellent job. I just hope the next Nexus doesn't turn out to be a 5 inch display or something. Phones are getting rediculously oversized.