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Ex-Nokia chairman admits: "we were not successful in using Microsoft's OS"

0. phoneArena 17 Oct 2013, 08:42 posted on

An ex-Nokia chairman who was involved in the process of selecting the new Nokia chief executive officer in 2010 claims Stephen Elop wasn’t the company’s first choice…

This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:46 29

1. pokharkarsaga (Posts: 384; Member since: 23 Feb 2012)

Even if MS acquires nokia,still Wp will fail .Wp team is the laziest team.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:52 16

4. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

MS has a big problem in my mind: It's still MS. Apple may not be cool anymore among the tech geek elite, but it's still "cool" in the consumer market. Microsoft on the other hand was always something you used because there was no other viable option. Once that appeared in the form of Android, it was curtains for WM, and WP8 has a crap ton of catching up to do.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:49 4

21. Shatter (Posts: 2036; Member since: 29 May 2013)

It won't be long, Microsoft's days with a monopoly on windows are numbered and they know it. Soon it will be all about open source OS using Linux on desktops, Ubuntu is better than windows all it is missing is the amount of developer support windows has.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:45 3

38. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

With Apple looking to unify its Mac and iOS devices - possibly with unified apps - could Android do the same thing and push into desktops and laptops?

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:42 6

47. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

only thing Linux is miising is everything good about window and i mean EVERYTHING from windows. i know i am a developer in linux kernel but i prefer windows to start kernel projects. to hell with its openess its totally crap for simple users and especially any GPU related activities.OPEN is not always best.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 15:31 1

54. Tommy1960i (Posts: 119; Member since: 11 Oct 2013)

WP fails because of the small number of apps in the windows marketplace mobile. In many countries wndows is and will be for a while the most popult computer OS because the Apple's Macs are too expensive and I don't imagine a PC with android OS. Lets keep android out of that. I don't want to have Android powered computers, clothes, watches, cars, houses etc. :)

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 17:27

59. amasog (Posts: 346; Member since: 22 Aug 2013)

"... Linux on desktops,"

Dreaming is free!! LOL!

posted on 18 Oct 2013, 02:33

66. Snoobab (Posts: 175; Member since: 07 Dec 2011)

Well said. I think this is Microsoft's biggest problem.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:21 4

15. timukh (Posts: 294; Member since: 04 Feb 2013)

I know they take a lot of time to release improvements but one of the main reasons for that is they make improvements for everybody. Even a $120 phone (520) is receiving continuous updates like GDR2, GDR3, wp 8.1 and more! Can u imagine that in any other OS? So it takes a lot of time to build the software because it has to run even on 512mb ram and receive further updates which is kind of impossible for android. I am not a wp fan or android hater (i own an xperia) but this is the main reason of their delays and most of the people dont really take this into account.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:23 4

16. rms.max (Posts: 95; Member since: 26 Sep 2012)

THEY should have gone to android in 2011.The immature , less capable (no 1080p & sd800 deviece till today) Wp OS & evil BAllmar killed nokia. M$ bought it around a third of Nokia’s value in 2010. A great game played by M$.Nokia could surely defeat sammy back in 2011.great mistake by nokia's foolish board members to trust MS & put all money on wp .

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:33 5

19. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

I don't buy the argument that Nokia only needed Android to win. Samsung already had a ton of momentum from the Galaxy S, and that started mid-2010. By then, Nokia was already heading south, and in the US none of our carriers even sold Nokia smartphones. They would have had to abandon MeeGo and adopt Android much, much earlier (2009) to get ahead of the game.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:55 5

27. rms.max (Posts: 95; Member since: 26 Sep 2012)

Look at the profit margin of sammy and nokia back in 2010 in phone bussiness. nokia was ahead.they had more money. well, Even if nokia adopted android in mid-2010 they don't go broke like today .They had enough money to at least survive , if they adopted android.Don't you think US carriers would sold more nokia's android smartphone back in 2011?When they abandon MeeGo and adopted wp,nokia begun to make loss,From Profit to loss.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:04 7

29. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

The profit-to-loss trend was already underway. They didn't decline because of WP, they declined because they took too long to take ANY action in the face of Apple-Android competition. MeeGo could have saved the company if it had been introduced in say 2007-2008, before the rise of Android.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:41 4

37. threed61 (Posts: 200; Member since: 27 May 2011)

Good point. And they couldn't take action because of a massive and Balkanized structure that fought over every little decision. Even the phones that were released were behind the times because of the beaurocracy. After years of development Maemo/Meego had only a few apps. It was the corporate structure itself that needed change. Elop certainly did that.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:46 2

48. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

i agree Time of N8 was the right time for Actual N9 and Meegoo release

posted on 18 Oct 2013, 00:26 1

65. rms.max (Posts: 95; Member since: 26 Sep 2012)

roldefol, All I wanted to say is that,wp was the last nail to the coffin .Wp destroyed nokia's last chance of survival .I agree with you,they made 100s of mistakes.
+1020 to you.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:53

25. InspectorGadget80 (unregistered)

All they care bout is NOKIA making money selling their handsets instead of m$ focusing on rebuilding their WINDOWS OS.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:27 9

32. akki20892 (Posts: 3901; Member since: 04 Feb 2013)

True if Nokia put more pressure on Maemo in 2006 there will be no iPhone and and no galaxy.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:47 8

2. mottykels (Posts: 383; Member since: 15 May 2013)

My faith is still for M.S :) what ever happen

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:54 9

5. Kishin (Posts: 704; Member since: 30 May 2013)

M.S still very cool looking

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:54 13

6. brar.arsh (Posts: 200; Member since: 12 Sep 2012)

Really? Do they pay you?

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:48

49. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

i guess they do pay for employees dont know about google cuz they givening everything for free NOT

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:08 11

11. fouadqr (Posts: 326; Member since: 21 Nov 2012)

My faith is still for NOKIA :) what ever happen

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:50 2

23. Shatter (Posts: 2036; Member since: 29 May 2013)

Some of the people who made Nokia good left and formed newkia to make Nokia like devices that run android.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:27 2

33. StreetNerd (Posts: 819; Member since: 08 Dec 2010)

My faith is still for NOKIA :) what ever happen

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:52 1

3. Kishin (Posts: 704; Member since: 30 May 2013)

Nothin to say cause it would not change anything

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 08:59 9

7. veer.d (Posts: 88; Member since: 12 Jul 2013)

biggest mistake of nokia to not release the prototype of around 2004 which are miles ahead of iphone.
Nokia waste a lot of time on market analysis like they did with tablet and on the other hand samsung takes the risks and just go ahead like the NOTE THE PHABLET so they are successful

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:49 2

22. Stoli89 (Posts: 333; Member since: 28 Jun 2010)

Nokia's made a few big mistakes. Allowing the N97 out the door with extremely poor specs at a time when the iPhone was gaining traction. This was a terrible error in terms of image/branding. In addition, to allow Symbian and Maemo/Meego teams to compete for resources...management should've laid down the law early and with clarity. Nokia also erred in not promoting touch based UI's very early in Symbian's development (2004 ish). Nokia should've also avoided the tie-up with Intel (Meego) and pursued Maemo with vigor. Given the series of prior errors, Nokia should've pursued Android in the USA while it continued to build out its Meego ecosystem...making sure to tie Qt to both OS's. This would've helped build brand equity in the USA, while accelerating Meego's own developer base. Lastly, the burning platform memo should never have been published...killing off its cash cow in the middle of a turnaround was suicidal. Elop should've been fired for that move. IMHO.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:30 1

46. ˇಠ_ಠˇ (Posts: 40; Member since: 29 Aug 2012)

Cough... Dell Streak... cough. #SamsungcopiedDell

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:51

51. AliNSiddiqui (Posts: 382; Member since: 19 Sep 2012)

The whole S Pen thing is why Note succeeded

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 16:11 1

56. ˇಠ_ಠˇ (Posts: 40; Member since: 29 Aug 2012)

No it's not... nobody uses it except for artwork or for writing notes, which people usually use tablets or actual paper for anyway... #tryagain

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:03 1

8. itsdeepak4u2000 (Posts: 3718; Member since: 03 Nov 2012)

He's correct...late to the party...

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:04 1

9. Champion (Posts: 12; Member since: 14 Oct 2013)

Wp will not fail..

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:06 8

10. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

WP still has potential to pick up converting dumbphone and Blackberry users. I don't see them converting many iPhone or Android users though, which leaves them perpetually in third place.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:16 6

13. Googler (Posts: 813; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)

WP is holding on because of Nokia, and little else. It's a fast and smooth OS but lacks some things that people look for in a UI. If MS can keep the Nokia reputation alive (if the merger is agreed on), they'll hang around and keep it going. If MS screws this up, they have big problems. Overhauling WinMobile into WP made sense because it helped unify their ecosystem across platforms. If the cell phone portion of the ecosystem never gets proper traction, fixing it this time will be a lot harder. Best thing going for MS at this point is deep pockets.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:35 3

20. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

I think branding will be more important than MS realizes. I would consider buying a Nokia due to their hardware quality and reputation, but I wouldn't buy a Microsoft phone, even if the hardware heritage is there.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:03 1

28. Googler (Posts: 813; Member since: 10 Jun 2013)

I would have gladly bought a Nokia phone if they had gone Android. If they could have made a phone like the X7 but running Android and hardware to match the OS, I'd be first in line. Even the Asha phones are well built. Nokia's styling and hardware have been outstanding, hopefully they keep that going despite whatever happens with MS.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 19:07

62. Finalflash (Posts: 3090; Member since: 23 Jul 2013)

i doubt they will, where ever MS dip their hands, they usually kill it. The reason is that they think they know whats best, and end up displacing the talent that made it good in the first place. So watch as they make the nokia phone division they stole into a pile of ashes.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:11 5

12. AfterShock (Posts: 3698; Member since: 02 Nov 2012)

Death by medicine.
What cured their ailing, killed the body.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:16 2

14. jove39 (Posts: 1858; Member since: 18 Oct 2011)

WP may not be dominant player in market...but they'll retain small pie of market share...nokia should start making android phones as well...just let buyer decide what they want.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:25

17. Reluctant_Human (Posts: 886; Member since: 28 Jun 2012)

Or at least a dual boot phone like MS is trying to get HTC to do.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:32 3

18. TimothyS (Posts: 2; Member since: 08 Sep 2013)

Yeah, the mistake was hiring an idiot who was from Microsoft. What did you expect? Of course he was going to go with WP, Elop worked there!!! It was an all-round idiot decision and I'm not surprised that Nokia failed. Now, Elop is in line for a big promotion back at Microsoft. Coincidence? I think not.

What a shame. Nokia made some of the best hardware on the market, but was doomed to failure when their CEO became a Microsoft ex-pat.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:00 4

40. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

tim, I know you're new here, but most folks are aware of the fact that Elop acts on directives from the board, and doesn't have the power to redirect the company so strongly, and if he were doing something the board didn't agree with, he would have been fired and replaced. He did the job they wanted to. If you and all the other Elop-haters care/cared so much about Nokia, you, like myself, would have continued showing your support by actually buying their products and letting other folks know they're an available and viable alternative.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:21 1

45. Dastrix (unregistered)

+1 -box-
All the way.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 18:08

60. Altair (Posts: 367; Member since: 02 Feb 2012)

Timothy: you might not know enough for statemens like that. Your comments just makes you as the idiot here.

Worst decisions at Nokia was made by former CEO Kallasvuo. Another guy responsible there was mr. Vanjoki, who was leading mobile phone division who had 2000 embloyees doing the same as Google was doing with 500 (Android). Vanjoki and his 2000 guys failed to do anything against iOS and Android.

mr. Elop here did what was left there. He could do things a bit differently (softening platform memo), but still things would have happened like they did, just slower. Elop just smashed his hammer at table and sayd: "we have to ACT NOW!". He is not the idiot here.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 23:58

64. Reluctant_Human (Posts: 886; Member since: 28 Jun 2012)

Actually Timothy is right. Elop as CEO made the decision to go with Microsoft and scrap all the work that was being done by those 2000 employees called Meego (which didn't see the light of day). The CEO has the power until he is fired which is what the board has the decision to make. He even made the contract with Microsoft that penalizes Nokia if the share holders vote against the sale. He was responsible for the day to day decisions and operations so yes he is to blame. Altair and box you are both wrong in that aspect.

If you care about a company you should buy their product anyway. What kind of sense does that make? Corporations should earn their sales not get it out of pity.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:52 1

24. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

I said it once, they should have used Android and Windows instead of going solo Windows and would have faired better, exclusive deals are always trouble.. .

Oh and the new SwiftKey keyboard is kinda awesome

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:13

30. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

Name a company that's had success with both their Android and Windows lines though. One is bound to get more attention and marketing muscle. What incentive does Samsung have to invest heavily in ATIV when they're raking in billions from the S and Note?

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 09:53

26. InspectorGadget80 (unregistered)

Would be a miracle if they make a Android OS hand set but we will never see it happened

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:24 2

31. Deaconclgi (Posts: 405; Member since: 03 Nov 2012)

1.Microsoft HAS NOT bought Nokia
2. Microsoft WILL NOT buy Nokia
3. Microsoft NEVER announced that they are buying Nokia for any amount of money.

Finally....FACT: Microsoft has announced intentions to buy Nokia's DEVICES AND SERVICES Divisions with the deal PENDING APPROVAL in early 2014.


1."Nokia adopting Windows Phone exclusively and as company’s fortunes declined it was bought for $7.2 billion by Microsoft. That’s just around a third of Nokia’s value in 2010."
2."If (or rather after) Microsoft is approved to acquire Nokia in 2014, the Finnish company will focus on its maps and network, while all phone business will now happen under Redmond rule."

Microsoft is NOT buying Nokia! It is easy to understand what it is Microsoft wants to buy for the $7.2 billion. Microsoft wants to buy Nokia's Devices and Services division and NOT Nokia.

I HATE this poor reporting that is seen on PA and several other sites concerning the Microsoft's interest in purchasing Nokia's D&S division. Please report the facts, some people may take what you say as a fact and then they will turn around and spread lies innocently.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:36 2

35. roldefol (Posts: 4242; Member since: 28 Jan 2011)

Semantics. Microsoft is essentially buying Nokia's consumer products division. Your argument is the same as someone saying Google doesn't own Motorola because they only bought the Mobility (phones and set-top boxes) division.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:55 1

39. Deaconclgi (Posts: 405; Member since: 03 Nov 2012)

Microsoft isn't "essentially buying Nokia's consumer products division". If approved, Microsoft is only buying Nokia's Devices and Services division. Nokia will still exist, just as it did when it made tires, boots and other consumer products and Nokia as a company will remain entirely separate to make consumer products outside the scope of any specifics of the possible selling of their Devices and Services division.

If Google bought Motorola Mobility, then that is what they bought, if the other part of Motorola exists outside of Google and is separate and not owned by Google then they did not buy Motorola.

Saying Microsoft is buying Nokia is simply NOT true, no matter how you want to compare or how many times people state it.

What is true is that Microsoft wants to buy a part of Nokia and this has been clearly announced and detailed to clear any confusion that Microsoft ISN'T buying Nokia.

Fact: Google DIDN"T buy Motorola and does not own Motorola. You said it yourself and so did Google.


Google bought Motorola Mobility and not "Motorola". Motorola solutions is not owned by Google.

The Google and Motorola story does NOT apply to Nokia as Nokia did not split into 2 separate companies and then having one company purchased.

Nokia is one company and the one company, Nokia, is NOT being bought by Microsoft as of this writing. Microsoft desires to purchase the devices and services DIVISION from Nokia.

Motorola Mobility was a SEPARATE company from Motorola Solutions and not a division of Motorola as of January 4 2011. That "Motorola" was purchased by Google.

Not the same situation and that does not change the fact that Microsoft is NOT buying Nokia.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 16:21

57. tadaa (Posts: 267; Member since: 18 Apr 2013)

read your comments. see how confusing it can be? they simplify facts for better understanding as people don't like to read long, hard to grasp, paragraphs that overstate facts. its like talking with mojo jojo

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:10 2

44. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Thank you. I wish this could be a floating caption on every Nokia/Microsoft article everywhere.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:31

34. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

Another Victor H. article with suspect paraphrasing so as to be critical of Microsoft and Nokia. What else is new?

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 10:38

36. genkidama20 (Posts: 52; Member since: 10 Feb 2012)

I loved my Nokia 928. The camera was AMAZING. It was fast and speedy. I loved the simplicity of WP. Even my wife could pick it up and use it with very little learning curve.

But, I HATED the Windows app selection. I missed my Android apps so much that I had to go back. So, sold my Nokia and got me an old DROID Razr just so I could get back the Android apps that I missed. For me, it was the apps. I just got tired of the sucky Windows Phone apps (or lack thereof).

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:06 1

42. Deaconclgi (Posts: 405; Member since: 03 Nov 2012)

I'm glad you found a device that works best for you.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:49

50. sergiobr (Posts: 708; Member since: 25 Feb 2013)

Go Android Nokia !

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 11:58

52. Pdubb (Posts: 248; Member since: 08 Aug 2011)

I'm curious as to what this Ex-executive would have done different. One thing is clear they were in a steep decline. The iPhone had become a juggernaut by 2010 and I cannot remember any Nokia phone in any carrier here in the US when I went to buy a device in 2009. Also by going Android they would have had to develop the OS just as all other oems with Google looking over thier shoulder. Nokia still developed Meego after going Wpin essence splitting limited resources. Yes MS bought a division for @ 7 billion but how much had they already given Nokia? 2? 3 billion? We know Google would not have given them money until they gained traction. MS was a decent partner.

posted on 17 Oct 2013, 14:15

53. runzlord (Posts: 227; Member since: 13 Oct 2013)

The fact is microsoft has to improve on it os. I just hate the fact its ios alike. If microsoft wed all it os's, terminate windows RT, make the main Windows os optimized for phones to run on lumias, .exe has enough apps to take on android! Thats one! 2. It will intrest app developers and make them build more apps 4 windows. And i wont be so tasky 4 MS since basic apps on windows shows vertically when u use multi-windows. The need to remove some restrictions. We all know if u care about security, ios is what u go for. So ms should stop playing a game of security and remove its restrictions. Majority of the public care less about security! If this is false, android wont out sell iphone!. Another example, is this. I went to ppsspp website. Normaly ppsspp has and app 4 android. I has an app 4 jail broken ios. No app 4 windows phone. Now when asked why, they said wp is like a non-jailbroken ios. And if ms reduse it restriction i would invite more apps like ppsspp! If they cant. Then they should beta wed all the os's cos ppsspp has an app 4 windows in .exe! Therefore if i like the ppsspp app, wp is a 'no go area' 4 me! Therefore im neva going to by a lumia!

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