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Elop chose Windows Phone because it gave Nokia a "key point of differentiation"

0. phoneArena 02 Mar 2013, 21:23 posted on

Nokia CEO Stephen Elop is always pretty good for a generic marketing quote, and he definitely gave a few of those in a recent interview with Bloomberg. But, this time Elop also gave a couple of more interesting generic quotes, one of which was to say that Nokia chose Windows Phone because it gave Nokia a "key point of differentiation"...

This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 16:11

128. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

No worries, my autocorrect has been intrusive today as well (though typing long paragraphs and not reviewing before posting doesn't help much either)

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 17:22 1

131. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

I feel your pain man, I feel your pain

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 21:58 1

8. urtard (banned) (Posts: 82; Member since: 30 Jan 2013)

Completely wrong.

If Nokia made Android phones, they would get cannibalized by just like every other Android manufacturers by Samsung.

Nobody else gives a cr@p about Windows Phone. HTC and Samsung makes perhaps 1 or 2 Windows Phones, just to shut Microsoft up. Samsung doesn't even care about the Ativ S.

Elop made a risky decision choosing Windows Phone, but it was pretty much the only option for them. They may do well in the short run but if in the long run, every other manufacturers start making Windows Phones, that's when they are truly boned; they would need some exclusivity with Windows Phone to last in the long run. If Nokia apps on Windows Phone are only available on Nokia models, then that's exactly what they need.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:02 5

11. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

urtard, where di you get the impression that Nokia was going to be outgunned by other lesser OEM's, such as LG, SONY, and HTC. Nokia phones have better durability and design than Samsung, and never mind the others. I think you're out of your mind thinking that the plastic crap being sold by the other vendors is going to doom Nokia's products. Stop living in the past...

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:07 3

15. urtard (banned) (Posts: 82; Member since: 30 Jan 2013)

Butthurt fanboys can't reason. You're the one out of your mind if you think Nokia would stand a chance in the Android turf, when existing competitors are having a hard time as it is. Also, Nokia also makes "plastic crap".

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:24 3

22. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

urtard, I have no clue what wtf you think constitutes quality in terms of smartphones, but your're clearly on something if you think that Nokia is lacking in quality. A durable polycarbonate shell (such as found on the Lumia 920) is not the same thing as a plastic phone that easily falls apart. Stop talking about things that you have no clue about...

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:32 1

25. urtard (banned) (Posts: 82; Member since: 30 Jan 2013)

Polycarbonate is plastic lol and just about every manufacturers use "polycarbonate". Do you even know what you're getting at?

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:40 3

28. papss (unregistered)

You clearly have no idea.. There are higher grades of polycarbonate such as the lumia and there are really cheap plastic/polycarbonate such as the S3

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:11 1

46. rusticguy (Posts: 2828; Member since: 11 Aug 2012)

But Polycarbonate on Windows is better than Cheap Plastic on Android at least as of now from market share point of view :D

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:46 1

31. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

urtard, compared to my Lumia 920, your smartphone camera sucks. I really don't care what other non-Nokia smartphone you have, because your cam sucks the big one. I'll bet the audio and signal quality of my Lumia is better than your phone as well...

Nokia is only second to Apple in terms of quality, but the 920 is a better value than the iPhone5 by a long shot. Same goes for your SGIII, DNA, Nexus 4, Sony Xperia Z, and HTC 8x. Even the One is not superior, and even the NOTE II is lacking in some areas as well (no QI wireless charging, and a dim primary screen).

In other words, you have no clue about what quality really means. End of story.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:21 4

52. 14545 (Posts: 1535; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)

"compared to my Lumia 920"

There it is folks. UP bought a 920 so now he has to prove to himself, and everyone around him, that he made the right decision. He is so insecure in that decision that he will stop at nothing to flame and make false accusations just to prove his case. Just like politics.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 00:08 1

65. SuperNexus (Posts: 127; Member since: 18 Jan 2013)

there is only one word for you - NokiaZombie.

Lumia 920 is overpriced, with very less features with a boring UI.
If you like UI then it is only matter of time when you will get bore because only thing you can do is change color and make tiles small and large.
If you don't get bore from this and doesn't realize limited features and apps then you have no clue about what quality really means. End of story.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 01:13 2

72. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

Since when do people get their jollies due to using the OS? WP8 gets the job done, and it also does it more securely than Android. It doesn't have 800,000 apps, but most of that stuff being circulated in the Android sphere is garbage quality anyway. I'd sooner have a smaller collection of apps that are meaningful and better quality, versus an entire library of low quality wares.

Bottom line: quantity does not mean quality. Also, the Lumia 920 has the best camera, outside of the 808, which is also built by Nokia. Fact, not fiction.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 01:33 1

75. SuperNexus (Posts: 127; Member since: 18 Jan 2013)

All apps in WP stores are inferior than Android apps.
Don't you know that.
WP apps need more polish,

I don't know but when did you try all 800k apps.
Android not only get job done but it will entertain you.

You should buy Nokia 100, it is also gets the job done and it is far cheaper than 920.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 08:43

99. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

As a former android user and a WP user of almost a year, you are full of crap. The WP apps are much more refined, have a pleasantly common appearance and functionality, and because of the common hardware within the WP ecosystem, more general compatibility and fewer functionality issues.
Yes, some Android apps have higher graphics capabilities, but only the top-end phones (DNA, Note2, Optimus G, etc) can run them properly, whereas a Lumia 520 can run the same apps as a 920, sometimes better because it is pushing lower resolution. Higher graphics doesn't mean more polished or refined, just higher-res. In fact sometimes it can be worse, as the app will be advertised for its graphics prowess but be a crummy program or experience. My favorite app right now (exclusive to Windows Phone and Windows) is ARMED!, which is essentially like Starcraft but on a smaller scale.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 08:33

97. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Overpriced?! It's $450 without a contract on AT&T, you fool. Iphone5 is $600, Galaxy S3 is like $700, Note 2 is $800. It's a bargain!

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 10:24

107. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Urtard, I invite you to ask your local SWAT team to swap their polycarbonate riot and face shields for regular plastic, and see how they react. Or fighter jets, or hockey helmets, or safety glasses. There IS a difference, and a substantial one at that. I love the polycarbonate on my Lumia and wouldn't change it for any other material commercially viable right now, save perhaps carbon fiber.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 14:15 1

119. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

lets talk about alumimium bodies only good thing is light and looks bad ass in first few months othervise they are put "IN THICK AND FAT PROTECTIVE CASES" ahahha so much for being premium my Ass when u cant even keep it open

my guess is more then 70% of sgs3 owners never see the actual body after they put them in cases fancy or crapy cases hahahaa too bad alumium sucks when it comes to scratching effects the color on SGS3 is as crapy as 90's phone so yeah 920 owner will rarely use case BECAUSE the phone is solid to the bones with solid color scratch huh u can even slice the top and u see same color under the hood not just surface i used L800 and a year later it still feels like a month old phone.

for facts i have friends with iPhones and SGS2 and 3s all had them in cases ROFL and some makes the phone weight over 180gm

so i guess if u live in fancy world with cases its u imagination not actully preimiumness of phone unless it is everlasting

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:38 3

27. papss (unregistered)

Agreed. It's not cheap at all.. It's not painted.. It's durable as hell

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 14:01 1

118. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

your and all other guys have valid point but the real thing happened behind the scene was MS made a deal with Nokia about WP7>8 a complete transition for 250Million$ in return per year or month i dont remeber exaclty and this deal was for 2-3 years guess nokia might want to go around but they cant during this time but after that who knows but still wp8 is not fail its not best in UI but it can evolve faster then other OS if the MS wants too

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 21:55 6

7. tusshharish (Posts: 342; Member since: 23 Oct 2012)

nokia choose wp because its very clean neat attractive having great ui. nokia puts their touch in their lumia models and makes them perfect...............

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:06 5

14. nikenturd (unregistered)

Yo Elop, ever wonder why most people dislike Windows phones?

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:11 4

18. SuperNexus (Posts: 127; Member since: 18 Jan 2013)

I think instead of depending only one platform, they should start producing other platform phones too.(like Android,WebOS,Jolla)

It is not about "Key Point of differentiation", it is about giving customer more choice.

and other manufacturer also produce Window phone, so it is not really a differentiation.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:36 2

26. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

There's something you forgot that gives Nokia an edge with their WP8 Lumia line: Windows Phones require less hardware and memory to achieve the same level of performance in most cases as Android devices. That means Nokia can save money on every device by marketing a dual core flagship instead of a quadcore. The only reason for quadcore being needed on an Android device is because of the sluggish and resource heavy OS itself...

As for other competiting WP8 OEM's, nobody holds a candle to Nokia, and they own the playing field, small though it may be at this time.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:59

64. SuperNexus (Posts: 127; Member since: 18 Jan 2013)

People like to have more features and apps but Window phone is restricted and has 1/5 of android apps.
There are many important app which window is still missing.
and how many people like window phone.....well market share give the answer of that.
All I am saying that if Nokia offer other OS phones too then it will be more profitable than only depending on single OS.
Because profit from Window phone will be same but other OS will also give Nokia more profit.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 10:28

108. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Name 5 "important" apps WP is missing. Don't even think about saying instagram or remove run or any of that flash-in-the-pan junk. Truly "important" apps.

I won't hold my breath.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 10:35

109. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Temple run, not remove. Bleh.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 22:19 3

20. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

Reality check: nobody (except Samsung) makes any significant money from producing Android devices.

Nokia would have wasted their time trying to be a copy cat like everybody else, and would have gone broke by now. Also, Microsoft is finally getting serious about competing in the mobile world, which means a unified OS is going to be released at some point in the near future. They already made big strides towards that goal with Windows 8, and it's entirely possible that the next generation of Windows Phones may end up running the same OS as what's installed your desktop or laptop.

Nokia has a future with Windows Phone, which is more than they had before they made the switch. Burning platform or not, Symbian was dead long before Elop took over...

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:02 7

41. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

Nobody is making significant money from windows either, that argument is flawed I don't see any of the current top windows phone devices meaning better cash for anyone

Why is samung so successful?

1. Important main product lineup (Galaxy S and Note Series)
2. Actual advertisement of the product (you ever saw a good android commercial that was not from a Samsung device?)
3. The devices look nice
4. They don't screw up the ui (I'm looking at you HTC)

Samsung is winning because its actually doing it right, Nokia can do that too....

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:36 1

56. 14545 (Posts: 1535; Member since: 22 Nov 2011)

The paid OS market has to play dirty, if they don't they won't last. Mainly because people will realize there are better open source alternatives.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 06:19 1

93. faisal8708 (Posts: 104; Member since: 15 Nov 2011)

I will refer u to the verge's interview with HTC head of design and according to him if u add licence fees and software cost attributed to android its not much difference b/w android and wp

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 00:51 2

68. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

WP8 came out in late October, so you pretending that it's not profitable is the same as me saying the HTC ONE isn't going to sell very well. And before you make some stupid reply suggesting that Windows Mobile or Windows 7.x was the same as Windows Phone 8, think again. It's like a completely different operating system compared to before. Why do you think the older devices were not upgradeable?

You Android fans are pathetic. Get a life, and stop dissing other competing platforms.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 04:42 1

87. SuperNexus (Posts: 127; Member since: 18 Jan 2013)

oh! man Microsoft brainwash you.

my suggestion to your illness - Never become a Fan of anything.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 06:16 2

92. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

What you said is a load of **** and you probably know it, I could say android 4.1 is a complete different is from 4.0 and 2.3 and is still selling way more.... This "windows 8 is the new kid on the block" is utter crap, an excuse that people made for Microsoft's mistakes

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 13:56

117. jroc74 (Posts: 6005; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)

You still trying to seperate WP7 from WP8? I thought you gave up on that....lol.

What happens when WP9 comes out? We gonna hit the reset button again? Do you think for a minute that ALL Android sales....are from devices that came with 4.0?

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 08:30

96. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

There have been good Android ads before. Droid, the HTC OneX with the goat, Xoom, DNA, etc. Samsung just carpet-bombs the ad space, much like apple. Its ads are also arguably more affective and effective with them poking fun at the iphone's many shortcomings.
As for UI, personally I find TouchWiz to be the most unpleasant Android overlay/launcher I have tried, and while it isn't as heavy as Sense, its not as pretty nor efficient. I really like the Blink thing on the new One, though it it essentially a fancy WP setup.
Samsung is also dominant because it is a component manufacturer as well as an OEM, and it sells a lot of cheap phones alongside its flagships. If they sell 100 Rugby 3s to a large construction company to one Galaxy Note 2, they still come out ahead. Much like Nokia with its top-down setup, have a flagship (N8, Lumia 900, Lumia 920), give it a strong public awareness, and folks will see a Nokia and connect it with what they are aware of. So while they may not purchase the 920, they might get an 820 instead (or a 301 or 105) because of brand recognition. Which is one of the reasons I think rebranding their location services as "HERE" is not the best move. No one can buy a HERE phone, they can buy Nokias.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 09:51 1

103. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

The original droid ads where relatively good, and made something interesting (they also poked fun at apple if I remember right) but the Xoom ads showed nothing about the device actual features, haven't seen droid DNA ads but if it included exploding robots then its a bad add.

For example

One Samsung ad showed people they can see a movie and text at the same time, one ad showed that they can take one pictures and all get copies of the same picture instead of having to take individual shots, a few ads showed the S bean feature... And so on

I personally like touch wiz could be a me thing but I consider it to be the most efficient android ui I've seen, easy shortcuts for setting in the notification bar, a standard row of icons, the swipe to dial or text and many other features

I saw the HTC one and honestly the only interesting thing is blink feed (and I bet someone is working on making an app that works like it as we speak... Of wait there is also chameleon if memory serves right but the rest is retarded, like the giant clock on the app drawer, the old 2.x scrolling system, the huge horizontal battery control (worth around 2 spaces worth of icons) the horrible menu button that pops when there is no overflow menu on an app, or the fact that it has two buttons and has some weird set of icons... Many things about this new sense are a major head ache compared with touchwizz, is not about Samsung doing it right, is about HTC doing it wrong... But that's my first impression of the new sense... Will have to see for reviews and more peeks but its not looking too good

Brand recognition is important you can see any Samsung with android is a galaxy (low end and high end) same with lumias, its why I think Nokia could be a super smart android seller...

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 16:27

129. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Right. I think part of Samsung's dominance is also tied in with Motorola and HTC's smaller capacities. When the "Droid" line was new, Motorola was king of the hill, shared with HTC since they made the G-series. Samsung saw what was up, converted their Blackjacks to Android, and stated making oodles and gobs of them and the Galaxy series. In like kind, Samsung also made the Galaxy series on all the major carriers, something apple finally started doing and Nokia should follow suit.

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:09

45. rusticguy (Posts: 2828; Member since: 11 Aug 2012)

Before NOKIA, Novel took pride in surviving off M$ Coupons ... now it's Nokia next is Dell ... all know why M$ dished out COUPONS ... just to kill LINUX ... Dell is a game to kill UBUNTU :)

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 08:45

100. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)


posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:46 1

59. Muzhhur (Posts: 260; Member since: 14 Sep 2012)

Well, Elop does not count, so theres no reason to belive what he could tell anybody

posted on 02 Mar 2013, 23:50 3

62. thelegend6657 (unregistered)

Differentiation ?
What is he talking about ?
An android UI on nexus , Optimus , Sony , HTC , huawei etc is different .
But on windows phone , its the same !
Hardware is the biggest differentiatetor on windows phone

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 00:17 7

66. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

The so-called Nokia fans seem to be more M$ fans than anything. It seems you guys have no faith in Nokia whatsoever. You can sling all the mud you want at Android, but the fact remains...people want it! And if you wanted Nokia to be number one again, you really wouldn't care if they got there with multiple OSs or not. We get it, you hate Android and you think wp8 is perfect. But no one is buying it...LITERALLY! Why does an Android based Nokia scare you guy so much, that you would rather see Nokia die than see it succeed with Android?

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 00:48 1

67. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

WP8 is the fastest growing OS in the world. Android had it's day, and now it's reached it's peak. Deal with it...

Nokia doesn't have to market an Android device to become successful. It's already becoming successful again, and Nokia's profits will increase with time, as will WP8's market share, mostly at the expense of Android and iOS. The only ones who really want Android are cyber-criminals, becase it's so damn easy to develop and distribute malware on that platform compared to everything else.

You like Android? Good for you. Stick with your malware infested smartphone or tablet, while the rest of us enjoy a more secure online experience.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 01:02 3

70. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

Yeah, yeah...malware, WP more secure, whatever. Fastest growing? What are they at now, 4% after almost 3 years now? If they grow any slower they'll have a negative share by Q4.

Again, sling all the mud you want. Why are you so threatened by Nokia making an insecure, malware infected device that I would actually buy if it will help Nokia? Nokia is selling buildings and anything not nailed down. How much longer do you really think they have? Why are you so scared of Android?

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 01:24 1

73. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

Nokia has roughly six billion in the bank, and is not going broke anytime soon. Also, I fail to see why selling their HQ building and then relocating their production facilities to Vietnam is a bad thing. These are smart moves, and give the company the cash it needs to continue production as well as R&D. Also, they have one of the larget patent collections of any major IT organization, including Apple and Google. Do not under-estiminate the potency of patents for generating cash. Blackberry did, and look where it got them?

Nokia doesn't need Android to make money. WP8 is the established third ecosystem, and it's only been released for a few months, which accounts for it's tiny market share. However, I predict in less than two years it'll have ten percent of the total market.

Why do you love Android so much? It's an OS, not a woman for crying out loud. If it was a woman, then it would be the village bicycle. Popular, but unsafe to play with ;o)

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 02:20 3

77. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

Yeah, your right! Look at how well having a bunch of patents worked out for Motoro...wait a minute. That wasnt enought to save the company though, right?

And another 2 years to hit 10%? Windows phone 7 was the first revamp of Windows Mobile, so are are you saying its gonna take a total 5 years for Nokia to turn this ship around? Sometime I feel like a bigger Nokia fan than many of the current users, because I actually want them to succeed with multiple OSs, rather than see Elop kill the company.

Nokia needs to change it up! Add some Android, WebOS, Sailfish, Sailboat, or whatever it takes to stay alive. But if anyone is treating anything like a woman, it's the so-called Nokia fans. They want Nokia all to themselves and if she even looks at another OS, they get extremely jealous.

I like Android because of the flexibility, customization, and google services. I can make my phone look, function and performs just about any way I want it to. I can't do that with any other OS. And it's about as unsafe as any other OS currently available.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 02:54 1

79. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

You are completely wrong: Android is less secure than WP8, BB-10, and iOS. Sure, you can do many things with it, but that flexibility comes at a price, in terms of both security and fragmentation.

Also, WP8 OS runs fast and smooth even on less powerful devices. The low end Androids are crap, and that's a fact. I guess the OS code is sloppily written or something. Whatever the reason, it's just not optimized for speed. you need a quadcore just to move a few pixels on the screen.

Let's get something straight: WP8 is completely new, and is not an evolution of Windows Mobile. The fact that Microsoft made the code doesn't mean it's the same as anything that came before it. That means that it has gained almost four percent in only a few months, understand? Microsoft will have carved out around 25 percent of the market by 2016, and Nokia will still be in business, in spite of the nay sayers.

There is another thing that you and other Android users are forgetting: if Intel succeeds in their latest efforts, then you can expect x86 compatability for Windows Phones in the not too distant future. That means the app problem will be essentially resolved, since Windows Phone and Windows 8 share the same kernal. Most people still use desktops and laptop computers, and having a smartphone or tablet that integrates is useful and appealling to say the least.


Nokia will compete successfully, and won't be running Android OS anytime soon, if ever...

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 06:28 3

94. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

Windows 8 runs fast on even low end devices? That's another excuse you guys come up with, I invite you to check the review of the lumia 510 it lags and not all apps are avilable for it

Dude windows 8 is an evolution... How many times you guys are going to cry foul and says let's start this from day one? So when the next windows version goes is going to be a new OS and then the next and the next.... Do I want to be with a company like that? No thanks

Also this x86 issue its your last attempt at making excuses for MS, look at the x86 surface? Thing low battery heavy, port that to a phone and you have a huge calamity... Also you want an application made to run around 10+ inches working its way on 5- inches? Please stop dreaming

And let's not forget the surface phone... When MS releases its own phone.. What happens to Nokia... If they don't become MS property by then

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 10:02 2

104. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

Window 7 and windows 8 are like Gingerbread and Ice Cream Sandwhich, they're two iteratations of the same OS. Wp8 isn't something brand new that has no similaritity to WP7? So that whole "just released a few months ago" thing just isn't holding water my friend. Wp8 IS an evolution, of Windows Phone7. You know it, I know it.

I've been using Android since 2009, and I've never had a virus or any kind of security issues, but if you want to believe that Android is so horrible...that's fine. You're going to believe whatever will feed you hatred of Android so I won't even bother with that.

The heaviness of Android doesn't bother me. So the fact that wp8 doesn't NEED a quad core processor and Android does really doesn't move me either. The Prius doesn't need as much gas as my truck, but that doesn't make the Prius better for me.

And that other thing us Android users keep forgetting (because I guess you're thinking we don't keep up with all the latest news in the cellular industry) about x86 compatibility...that's great news...for Microsoft! That will do nothing to help Nokia. If you think using the desktop version of Office on a phone is just the thing you need, x86 compatibility is the best news ever. But how many people out there are going to buy a Nokia device because it will be just like using the computer you hate at home?

If Nokia makes it without Android, great for them. If they want to slowly climb back to the top using only M$, that's their choice. They can continue to ignore all the "Android! Android!" chants just like Steve Jobs tried to ignore the "Verizon" chants when he couldn't get a connection during the iPhone 4 launch. But all that does is force Nokia/Android fans like myself to buy another company's products, which may in turn make me a new fan of that other company. Samsung wouldnt be the new number one if Nokia were making android phones, so this is great news to them. This is a slow and painful takeover of Nokia by M$, bottom line. I hope it doesn't happen, but that's what it looks like.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 13:49 1

114. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)


WP8 is NOT an evolution of Windows Mobile, which was based on the old Windows CE code. WP8 has a completely different kernal, and devices running older versions of WP6.x and WP7.x cannot run any of the newer WP8 apps. It' can be compared to the introduction of Windows 7 64bit, which is completely different than 32bit Win7. The newer WP8 devices have limited backward legacy compability, but many of the old apps don't work properly. It is technically incorrect to refer to an OS that is based on an entirely different kernal as being an "evolution" of the previous OS. The evolutionary characteristics only relate to the manner in which the OS tackles certain tasks, but there is nothing directly linking WP8 to the previous versions, other than it being developed by the same company (Microsoft).

Also, Android is plagued by more Malware, by virtue of being more popular if nothing else. It makes no difference if you feel that your smartphone or tablet hasn't been compromised. Those devices could already be compromised without your knowledge. As for speed, there's no question WP8 code is lighter on resources, and that makes it ideal for low end devices as well as the high end. If you think that the Lumia 920 is comparable to a Prius, versus other flagship smartphones, then you clearly have never used the device. It's on par in every way and form, but the real trick is that the Lumia 620 operates smooth and fast unlike other similiarily priced low end Android devices.

Additionally, I certainly don't hate my PC, and I'll be glad to have complete x86 interoperability and syncronization. WP8 needs better file management options, and a few other goodies to make it more manageable on the PC. However, it's still a good OS, and will only get better in the near future.

The only thing that you and I may agree upon is that Microsoft may have intentions of taking over Nokia, since it suits their ambitions. However, unlike Google which needed to buy Motorola Mobility for patents, Microsoft already has plenty of their own. The real value of Nokia is the product distribution network they still maintain, as well as their Navteq mapping resources.They also have potent collection of patents, which may be of use to both MS and Nokia for future battles against either Apple or Google.

Again, I think Android will still exist, and so will iOS for that matter, but they will have to make room for Windows based devices. Microsoft and Nokia will not be denied their place in the sun, and it is no longer just a two horse race....

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 14:33 1

120. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

You have taken a TON of pot shots at Android throughout this conversation and still you haven't convinced me that 1. WP8 is not an evolution of WP7 (put the two side by side in front of the general consumer, they would be able to tell the difference. And they will still look for either an Android or iOS device). 2. That windows is any safer that any other OS. Their reputation for virus magnets, whether true of wp8 or not, still precedes them. 3. That my device has been compermised without my knowledge. I'm no expert, but I am a lot more educated and observant than the average consumer. 4. That Nokia wouldn't been hugely successful with an Android device. I've been waiting for years, and there are many, many, many others still waiting for an Android based Nokia device. It's our dream config, so yes! It would do phenomenally better than the 920 IMHO. Since we are at a stalemate, I'm am going to bid you a due. (Really, it's because my wife is making me take her out to lunch and she would kill me if I dared pull up PA at the table. Lol!)

All that said... You sir have truely gained my respect! I've tried to have intelligent conversations with many-o-Nokia fans, and about 95% start in with the personal insults. Attacking other people's character. And just plain disrespectful for absolutely no reason at all. But this debate with you has been a very refreshing one I must admitt! We may not agree on much here at all, but I certainly look forward to reading more of your thoughts in the future! Oh and +1 for elevating the conversation.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 17:10

130. UrbanPhantom (Posts: 949; Member since: 30 Oct 2012)

Whateverman: Thanks for your input, and we'll have to agree to dissagree on some of these points. As for the possibile success of an Android based Nokia phone, it would be interesting to see, but I'm not convinced that it would do as well as some people tend to believe. I do think that many would like to have the option of buying such a device, and yet Nokia's past failure to adjust to the changing times would have left it in a similiar spot if it had opted to go with Android instead of Windows Phone. They didn't react quickly enough, and should have made the change much sooner. The company was nearly broke, and Nokia were glad Microsoft was willing to pay them to adopt and promote Windows Phone. It's a slow road back to health and prosperity, but so far I can say that WP8 has made great strides forward, and is generally being well received...

I tend to view WP8 as being entirely different from Windows Mobile (CE) in the sense that none of the previous devices are upgradeable, nor can they run any of the new WP8 apps. Others can view it as an upgrade if they wish, but the the code used in WP8 has about as much in common with Windows CE as WIN7 64bit does with DOS 6. The fact that the new code can run some legacy apps does not mean it's just a minor upgrade. It's a whole new operating system, and people need to understand this if they want to address the issue correctly.

Malware always attacks the most popular platforms, and Android is heavily targetted by a multitude of malicious code from private individuals, as well as corporate entities, and even foreign governments. The sad fact is that anti-virus detection is always one step behind the development and deployment of viri and other compromising techniques. WP8, and BB-10, and iOS have the advantage of being more tightly controlled, and in the case of WP8 and BB-10, much less popular. My criticism of Android is that owing to it's flexibility and the lack of restrictions for obtaining information about the core aspects of it's foiundation code, there is a much greater chance for Android devices to get hacked, or else become passive host devices used in attacks on other data infastructure. Google is too open about their code, and that makes it easier to compromise the OS in ways that are potentially detrimental to users, or else other users connected via live networks.

There's nothing personal about this, and I'm not out to call you names, or even comment about you being whipped and controlled by your wife (grin). My own wife is way, and that's the only reason I'm able to write such long discourses about the pros and cons of competing mobility solutions ;o)


posted on 03 Mar 2013, 22:10

133. Whateverman (Posts: 3262; Member since: 17 May 2009)

"or even comment about you being whipped and controlled by your wife"

Lol! Hey, wait a minute...

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 15:27 1

125. protozeloz (Posts: 5396; Member since: 16 Sep 2010)

I don't think you get this

Windows 8 is an evolution, the kernel and other stuff do not matter anyways because the logic of operations is virtually the same as windows mobile 7.x android has a kernel in 2.3 and a new kernel in 4.x and will have a new kernel on key lime pie, its not changing a thing... Same with apps applications made with the new SDK will use tools not aviable for 2.x devices and you can tell by the devs slowly killing lower android versions because of that. It happens on any OS as it moves forward and doesn't mean its completely different... I can agree with a reboot from 6.x to 7.x but the 7.x to 8 is not a new OS built from scratch, its an upgrade.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 15:49

126. jroc74 (Posts: 6005; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)

Thank you....thank you....thank you...

I was JUST getting ready to post something similar.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 17:28

132. -box- (Posts: 3991; Member since: 04 Jan 2012)

Windows Phone 7 and its derivatives are on the Windows CE platform, whereas Windows Phone 8 is on the same kernel as Windows 7, RT, and 8. More like Gingerbread evolving to Jelly Bean than Gingerbread to ICS.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 14:34

121. haseebzahid (Posts: 1853; Member since: 22 Feb 2012)

i wont disagree with u but i only wanted to to tell you why i hate android

its not basically i hated android but after i saw the reviewers atitude i made a statement i will never buy a android even if world has nothing else left to offer after looking at android fan comments and rage wars and bashing for no reason nor accepting the flaws only praisng i never wanted to join the crapy android braindead fans so i went for WP which dont realy have much of the no-brainers trying to troll every thing thats not green like Droid-BOT their are many but not as worst and pathetic as android ones.

although i admit android is very good OS no doubt i just felt it needed better class of users not thses junkies on net always trying to prove they are best while they suck s**t in front of their 54" HD 3D 1080P screens or whatever just one example

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 02:05 1

76. linas_ltu (Posts: 32; Member since: 19 Apr 2012)

I really hope to see Nokia growing up without Elop when nokia chooses android.

posted on 03 Mar 2013, 02:53

78. TerryCrowley (Posts: 194; Member since: 31 Jul 2011)

Stupid Nokia. Different isn't always better. While I jizzed myself over the hardware of the Lumia 920 the software was extremely lacking. I'd die for a 920 running Android.

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