Analyst blames Apple for slow NFC growth, we blame limited use
2. ultimatebatman (Posts: 52; Member since: 04 Dec 2012)
So basically it shouldn't be in the phone because it isn't common enough yet? If Android used the same logic, carriers would not have bothered with LTE. Basically, here is the order:
Android pioneers, Apple adopts only once Android laid the foundation, Apple sues
4. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
1) NFC was around well before Android. As stated, NFC is huge in places like Japan, and has been since before Android or the iPhone launched.
2) Not saying it shouldn't be in the iPhone yet, but Apple doesn't tend to adopt technologies until they are proven and have had time to mature. That's why Apple was late putting DVD into computers, and LTE into its mobile devices.
So, if the NFC infrastructure doesn't get built out (regardless of Android), Apple might not put it in the iPhone. And, a big problem with building out the infrastructure is that people have a very limited idea of what NFC can be.
6. lzsbleach (Posts: 155; Member since: 20 May 2012)
So Apple is not really a company that will bring something new to the market but they improve on products that have been proven or have huge potential to succeed. I think this one track mind of doing things like this can be very detrimental to them as they can be left behine. I think companies that are on the verge of dome always come up with the best products and push for innovation because its all or nothing; look at Nokia
9. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Apple will try to improve upon existing products. That's been the same business model for plenty of companies. The rewards may not be as big if you don't risk as much by pushing innovation, but a company can still be plenty successful.
13. lzsbleach (Posts: 155; Member since: 20 May 2012)
Doesnt that also depend on what type of companies are in the market to? Apple plays it safe but Google takes more risk and pushes for innovation more and I guess its because they have so many different things going on, that they cant lose. This innovation that Google is pushing wouldnt that put pressure on apple's products as they are the ones that are playing catch up? Consumers are becoming more aware of whats going on in the market too.
15. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Doing too many things can be just as bad as doing too little. There's a reason why Larry Page killed off a lot of products when he took over as CEO. Every company has to find it's own balance.
Google pushing something doesn't guarantee success any more than Apple pushing it would. Products succeed when consumers see the value in it, and that hasn't fully happened for NFC.
30. Bernoulli (Posts: 1451; Member since: 01 Sep 2012)
But it does show that at least they're not after the money but innovation, because they care for the consumer, unlike Apple that cares only about the consumer's wallet, hehe it's a shame even phones like the n9 had NFC but not the "new" iphone 5
32. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Google cares about the money too. Google wouldn't do something if there were no value in it, even if the value were just in gathering more info from users to make more money in advertising. Google is a business just like Apple, they just do business differently.
39. Bernoulli (Posts: 1451; Member since: 01 Sep 2012)
Well yeah, everyone cares about the money, but still Google at least tries new things unlike Apple, that sits back and waits for others, can you argue with that?
40. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Just because someone is the first out of the gate doesn't mean they make the most successful product, and it doesn't mean that you make the most game-changing product.
There were smartphones before the iPhone, tablets before the iPad, and MP3 players before the iPod, but the Apple products definitely had impacts on each market that no other device had.
Credit where it's due. Apple makes products that can revolutionize certain segments, but Apple isn't the company that is going to hold on to that segment for the most part, because others will outpace Apple.
31. Nadr1212 (Posts: 741; Member since: 22 Sep 2012)
Can't analysts just stop blaming and mentioning Apple for everything?
EVEN THOUGH it totally deserves the blaming part
5. RamyRamz69 (Posts: 390; Member since: 12 Dec 2011)
NFC is extremely useful. I use it on my Xperia Ion each and every single day whether it's Smart Tags, Beam or speakers. It just needs more marketing, it makes life much more simpler...
7. mnp188 (Posts: 19; Member since: 27 Apr 2012)
Ahhh... there we go again. This is where I hate phonearena - defending apple in the title itself.
I agree... your point is valid. But you don't have to prove apple innocent in the title itself.
11. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Not defending Apple or trying to prove the company innocent. In fact, I'm flat out saying that Apple is somewhat irrelevant in the whole thing.
As I've said many times, if you come looking for bias, you'll probably find it somewhere, even if it doesn't actually exist.
47. anshul0000 (unregistered)
you have a soft corner for apple..
48. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
The idiom is a "soft spot", but really I just don't completely hate the company. I don't personally like Apple products, but I'm not going to judge those who enjoy them. And, while I will freely admit all of the bad practices of the company, I'm not going to ignore that it has been extremely influential in tech over the years.
8. kirholstov (Posts: 136; Member since: 28 Jun 2012)
iOS doesn't have even a Bluetooth sharing option, if it will have NFC, I think that situation won't be better
25. Valdomero (Posts: 121; Member since: 13 Nov 2012)
Perhaps that's the reason why they don't adopt NFC yet, they may be figuring out how to only allow NFC to Apple products. Just like their bluetooth...
10. kellkeezy (Posts: 57; Member since: 17 Dec 2011)
@michaelheller and @imkyle
Nailed it completely, apple has always been known to adopt technology into their business
Just to let you know the patent office is what allows a company to own the ideas, which are sold by people or intellectual properties within a company or freelance. Lawsuits from one company to another is the equivilent of dogs pissing in a park.
12. RapidCat (Posts: 351; Member since: 12 Jun 2012)
nfc not only for payment. look what google does with Android Beam, easy transfer file. without pairing like bluetooth.
or sony with nfc tags.
without company like sony and google maybe nfc still stuck with payment.
43. Bernoulli (Posts: 1451; Member since: 01 Sep 2012)
If Sony Ericsson ruled again along with nokia we'd be having flying cars by now
14. roscuthiii (Posts: 1843; Member since: 18 Jul 2010)
Nicely done again Michael. Sheesh, I'm starting to feel like K.I.T.T. here with all the, "Well done Michael"s. Do a crappy write up for once so I can lambaste you a bit. ;-)
What it seems to all come down to here is that companies are beholden to shareholders so much that no ones willing to pull the trigger. No one wants to take a gamble without some kind of guarantee-able return of investment. Which is kind of an oxymoron. I guess this is where Apple does come into play. Forgoing all the other pros and cons that can be said of Apple, they were at least willing to stand up and say, "Oh yeah?! Well... Screw you, we're doing it anyway!"
It's not enough for someone to dip their toe in to test the waters... someone's gonna have to take the plunge to show NFC as a viable profit generator.
23. mrochester (unregistered)
When Apple innovates it tends to be something huge that the entire industry falls over themselves to immitate; iTunes, iPod, iPhone, iPad. This is usually because Apple puts decent amounts of time, money and effort into making these product get off the ground and be widely adopted. If anyone has a track record of taking an idea and putting enough oomph behind it to get it going, it's Apple, which is probably exactly what the analyst in question is referring too. I should imagine NFC will continue to bob along the ground until Apple get the infrastructure and agreements in place to make it a viable venture.
16. Slammer (Posts: 1074; Member since: 03 Jun 2010)
In your conclusion Michael, you do claim Apple is somewhat responsible. I respect that and I can't really disagree here. I do tend to justify the analyst's opinion more however.
The business and education enterprises have begun to heavily adopt the Apple platform. This then trickles down to business people and students having to invest in the platform as well. These two areas of interest and its extensions, are the ones that would benefit the most out of NFC. Business travelers and students that don't carry large sums of cash. It is said that if you build, they will come. If Apple does not include it for the more dependant consumer base , it will come slower. So, I have to believe that the analyst is not really far off base. My beef is that this is the problem with waiting and relying too heavily on Apple. Sure, they are a focal point for tech, but it delays moving forward. You can't fine tune unless you get everyone involved with the technology.
37. TROLL (banned) (Posts: 4851; Member since: 13 Apr 2012)
Very well said. Cause it's there country's pride and joy, also there are heavy investments and shares on Apple!
53. JunitoNH (Posts: 931; Member since: 15 Feb 2012)
Now, that my friend, is a clever and true statement. I rather see Apple succeed, and shares go up. I can care less what happens to Samsung from an investor point of view. I can always get an Android device, even if it is from GM.
24. mrochester (unregistered)
Although the problem might be people relying too heavily on Apple, the actual issue is that there isn't anyone else who seems to be able to do what Apple does. Google are currently the best placed to make NFC big but haven't really seemed to put as much effort behind the tech as they could have. Where are the agreements with Visa, Mastercard and transportation providers to use Android as a payment device? There are so many possibilities currently sitting unrealised.
44. networkdood (Posts: 6276; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)
It is out there... companies are taking their time with NFC...my Jack in the Box uses it now.
19. networkdood (Posts: 6276; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)
I am surprised that APPLE has not owned a patent on NFC tech, yet.
21. nwright94 (unregistered)
When I did use a device that had NFC, there was nowhere at all to use it in southwest Michigan. My brother hasn't used it once on his s3 and he's had it since launch day. It's just something that hasn't caught on in America yet, but like any other thing in the tech world, everyone's so quick to blame Apple. I've even seen some people blame apple for mobile malware. People just like to complain and always try to justify their complaining by blaming a company that usually has nothing to do with what they're complaining about.
26. CMonster (Posts: 7; Member since: 04 Dec 2012)
How would NFC be any more practical than using an app like Voxer? The only difference is that one goes over the network and the other goes directly from one phone to another. I guess with Voxer you have to know of the phone you are attempting to contact, but isnt that almost the same as knowing what frequency to be on using NFC?
When it comes to data transfer like S-Note or picture sharing, I could potentially see the use, but who are you really going to share something with that you wouldn't mind also having his/her number?
29. downphoenix (Posts: 2359; Member since: 19 Jun 2010)
I blame Apple, because everyone likes to cater to them. Until the iphone has an NFC chip in it, a lot of retailers wont really care about NFC. When Apple puts a chip in the iphone, a lot of retailers will care alot about it.
33. MichaelHeller (Posts: 2681; Member since: 26 May 2011)
Why would I blame Apple in that scenario? I blame retailers for ignoring all of the people that already have NFC, but can't use it.
38. TROLL (banned) (Posts: 4851; Member since: 13 Apr 2012)
We shall not worry, it takes time, and this NFC will be the latest trend,
54. JunitoNH (Posts: 931; Member since: 15 Feb 2012)
Ignorance is bliss, there isn't such thing as bad publicity.
35. jroc74 (Posts: 4974; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)
What I dont get is....how are these ppl gonna assume that if it was in iDevices, ppl were gonna use it? Are they really saying that Android users dont matter for advancing tech?
The iPhone not having LTE until later didnt hurt LTE.
Ok...reading some more comments...I guess its a chicken and the egg scenario...maybe retailers would put more resources into NFC if the iPhone had it. But even retailers have to know Android phones are damn near everywhere. Thats no excuse.
42. TheRetroReplay (Posts: 245; Member since: 20 Mar 2012)
You guys here at Phone Arena DO realize that companies are waiting for the most popular phone in the world to have NFC before the pour money into getting NFC readers right?
45. networkdood (Posts: 6276; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)
Android OS is the most popular - APPLE really only owns America...and a few other countries.
49. jroc74 (Posts: 4974; Member since: 30 Dec 2010)
Call me crazy...but the phone thats used by the most ppl, has the biggest marketshare would be considered the most popular from a retailers stand point. You are looking at it from another point of view.
50. networkdood (Posts: 6276; Member since: 31 Mar 2010)
true, I was looking at it from the OS view and not phone view...that is because Android is more than just one phone from one manufacturer.
51. rusticguy (Posts: 2828; Member since: 11 Aug 2012)
With or Without Apple NFC will forge ahead. Apple will have to incorporate it into their devices not by choice but by force (of market) ...
46. xfire99 (Posts: 542; Member since: 14 Mar 2012)
Not only apple refuse to implent NFC, banks, ISP are using there own way for mobile payment and all want a piece of cake with theirs own solution for mobile payments.
52. molanjames (Posts: 64; Member since: 11 Oct 2012)
Honestly NFC's would likely lead to a lot of hacking if they were wide spread. That's why apple chooses to go a different way. The expansion of the technology could just as easily go the passbook way. The best technology will be adopted for everything in the long run. For now it's prolly best that we try a few different methods and let people decide what they like better.
55. xfire99 (Posts: 542; Member since: 14 Mar 2012)
In which way are others methods safer then NFC? Even credit cards payments is safe and it even need any wireless transfer. But is it safe?