60 cents out of each dollar in industry profit will soon go in Apple's pocket
0. phoneArena 04 Nov 2011, 13:27 posted on
An interesting chart on the All Things D site shows what percentage of the cell phone industry's profits belong to each manufacturer on a quarter by quarter basis; currently more than half of the profits end up lining the pockets belonging to Apple...
This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here
1. ZEUS.the.thunder.god (unregistered)
PA are you serious ????
.. means who d hell would buy an ip5s in 2013 ????
36. ardent1 (Posts: 2000; Member since: 16 Apr 2011)
iPhone 5 to show up in 2012 if history is any guide. Besides support for LTE, the iPhone 5 will have other game changer features. While android OEMs continue to push better hardware features (as was the case in computers), Apple continues to focus on both the software and hardware.
50. ledbetterp3 (Posts: 467; Member since: 31 Aug 2011)
Seriously? I think android works on software much more than apple, because it's manufacturers such as samsung that work on the hardware. Since a bunch of separate hardware companies working alone, plus one software company focusing just of software, I think android works more than apple in both areas.
52. ardent1 (Posts: 2000; Member since: 16 Apr 2011)
Android is fragmented. Even Google acknowledges this problem. Android 4.0 is an attempt at addressing this fragmentation.
Again, it's a big problem for Google and the android ecosystem.
2. ZEUS.the.thunder.god (unregistered)
and when would you stop taking apple`s side ??? ... but i think apple really needs you to make some idiots beleive that ishi* is the best ..lol
4. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Yes because when PA reports facts such as devices sold or profits earned they are "taking Apple's side".
58. InspectorGadget80 (unregistered)
Thats all you ever care bout? You think Apple is number one bout cause of sales?
39. ardent1 (Posts: 2000; Member since: 16 Apr 2011)
The iPhone meets the needs of millions of users. Also it sets a standard that can't be matched by OEMs that can't create the OS. This is the same movie being played over again -- it's a repeat of MS-OS and various OEMs. The PC OEMs dominated the market, but couldn't make enough ROIC. The same will happen to android OEMs.
3. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Nice! With profits like these Apple will maintain it's industry lead in innovation and quality products. Can't wait to see the great products they create for us in the future.
8. ivanko34 (Posts: 617; Member since: 04 Sep 2011)
Nice! With profits like these Apple will make lawsuits to everybody who lead in innovation and quality products. Can't wait to see the great products blocked in the future.
12. twenti7 (Posts: 152; Member since: 09 Jul 2011)
You said it. Apple was once a serious leader in innovation, but ever since they've been sitting on that pile of cash they've grown lazy. They still make excellent products, and I'd still pay the extra money for a Mac over a PC any day, but at the rate the company is going that may soon change.
28. jacko (unregistered)
theres no innovation in copying
=1&t=3m29sis that i totally think is so true
30. Slammer (Posts: 1515; Member since: 03 Jun 2010)
Even you must find these profits ridiculous in any industry. Do you also support the oil industry's pricing and how they rape consumers?
I have made the following argument before. Apple products may be good, but are they the best they can be or even offer the most they can while raking in profits like this?
Don't you think you should be demanding more from a company that is making this kind of profit all while you need to wait for the next iteration for features that could've been in the previous?
There is a serious imbalance here.
My generation fought Apple by walking away for this kind of practice to the point where they almost went belly up. This new generation just doesn't seem to care. The generation doesn't care how much money or profits a company makes or how they do it. The generation just wants what it wants."
Then people wonder why this country is in the state it is.
40. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
There's a huge difference. Oil is a necessity. You don't have to buy any products. Please stop signing your posts like a moron.
43. Slammer (Posts: 1515; Member since: 03 Jun 2010)
So because Apple is not a necessity, it is ok to make the same practice? I'm sorry Taco, but I don't recognize this logic nor will I change my view.
Evidently, Apple is a necessity to you. You simply can't do with out Apple. I can, and I have. I would rather put my money into a company that is strong but also is willing to compromise a little less profit to address a finer balance.
I'm much too old to play games with companies that try to manipulate their followers. Maybe one day you will tire of the carrot dangling as I did.
By the way, I sign my posts because I believe in them from living half a centry of experience. I don't need to hide behind falsification or pretentious identities. I have nothing to prove to fellow posters nor do I need to be taught what I think is obvious crude misrepresentation out of coy marketing in products.
If you think I'm wrong, I would enjoy a more intelligent response of your knowledgeable view.
46. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
People CHOOSE to buy Apple products. No one is forced. If people don't like their product or price there are plenty of alternatives. You could also go without the product altogether. OBVIOUSLY people think its WORTH their money to buy Apple because it's BETTER than the alternative. Sure I can get a free crapdroid alternative. I prefer to spend the extra money and get the alternative.
This nonsense on PA by fandroids that Apple has somehow hypnotized consumers is ridiculous. If they bought the product and were dissatisfied or felt ripped off they'd not buy again.
69. Slammer (Posts: 1515; Member since: 03 Jun 2010)
First of all, let's get this out of the way.
I am not what you call a "Fandroid". I have used WinMo for years and then owned the original Apple iPhone. When WebOS came into the scene, I was hooked. I love WebOS and have now taken sight of Windows phones. For me, I love the choice of Apps and Android has filled that gap. The extent of my "Fandroidism" if you will, ends there.
Now to move on:
Your Straw Man fallacy of necessity Vs optional choice is, somewhat fragmented. Nobody is forcing anyone to purchase gas in support of oil prices. There are ways to get around it. It is sheer convenience that has driven society to rely on this type of fuel supply. Few people are going to convert their heat to wood powered furnaces or ride their bikes to work. These are choices that can be made but few will do so. So now it takes on the perception of necesssity. But is it really?
After returning to Apple to give them a second chance with the original iPhone, I found their dictatorship and directive to remain proprietary in their offerings, once again an intolerable practice. I chose not to subsidize funds to Apple in making record profits year after year while I am told what I can have or not have(Ex. Multi-tasking). Everyone else was enjoying it. I had Windows mobile that gave me mutitasking capability that is indispensable for many business applications. Apple completely left it out knowing they could get away with it for three iterations of the device. The less they offer, the more they make. I don't find this attractive. I also don't buy the fact that they use the "We don't feel it's ready" argument. Sheeple marketing is widely used in any industry and Apple has excelled in providing such measure. Look up sheeple marketing if you are not in understanding of what I convey.
I will say this once more and hope that this debate will be wrapped up and put to bed.
Apple is not a new company. They have been around for years. They indroduce a product such as the ipod/iPhone and remained true to their roots of retaining the walled garden approach. The new generation of consumers ignorant of Apple's model, are attracted to something new while being controlled like puppets on every offering while they bask in record profits. They have successfuly employed a technological hype for their products from other's ideas.
I'm not saying Apple wasn't smart in beating others to the market with some offerings, but to call them innovative, is just short of the entire truth. Steve Jobs(rest his sole) admitted right on camera that "Apple has always been shameless in stealing other's ideas". What more proof do people need?
Money is the only motivation for Apple to appease itself and its shareholders. If they can do it by escaping money spent on certain offerings, they will. Thanks to their continual hyperbole through cunning marketing, they leave their consumers short changed while the rest of us already enjoy the current benefits.
I cannot support this.
44. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
thanks for showing us that moron's sign their post.
11. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Didn't I already chase you off in shame once?
Do you realize all cell phones are made in these same factories and Apple now does regular inspections to ensure good working conditions.
Facts don't matter to a fandroid idiot though.
26. bucky (Posts: 2460; Member since: 30 Sep 2009)
Still better than android even eoth the problems. Not a good point
45. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
i havent seen too many i4s's getting 36 hr battery life like my SGS1, and its not rated nearly as well as the industry leading SGS2... which just blow's away the i4's battery life even by official ratings.. which as the i4s has shown, is just a "goal"..lolol
. Nice try though.
6. squallz506 (banned) (Posts: 1075; Member since: 19 Oct 2011)
too bad only 2 cents of the 60 will go towards R&D. with that kind of profit the iphone 5 should have a lightsaber built in.
7. mukrenol (Posts: 90; Member since: 03 Sep 2011)
every kudo points for apple... PA gets some commission...
that... sounds logical....
18. Hallucinator (Posts: 344; Member since: 24 May 2010)
And comments like that make you sound moronic
9. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
Even an idot cannot argue with the facts. Apple is number one. They make a superior product so they sell the most. People can say whatever they want about apple but the proof is in the facts. Plain and simple Apple Makes more then half of the industries profits obviously for a reason. The better product will sell more, and will continue to sell more. There is just no argument against that.
10. squallz506 (banned) (Posts: 1075; Member since: 19 Oct 2011)
here is the argument against it. the definition of "superior product" is entirely subjective. and there are so many more factors in selling a product besides quality. apple spends more on advertising than anyone else. apple products [generally] have more accessories. there are so many variables in the market besides quality.
13. Bigbluetundra (Posts: 45; Member since: 03 Nov 2011)
So, by your logic, a Kia is a better car than a Ferrari because they sell more? Interesting...
14. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Apple costs more AND sells more. There's no reason people would spend more for a worse product. Kia is way cheaper than Ferrari.
Sorry facts are facts. There's no arguing with what's staring you in the face.
21. superguy (Posts: 290; Member since: 15 Jul 2011)
Sure there are reasons. They don't know any better and don't consider other options. And they won't consider another option until they get burned, even if there are better and better-price options out there.
I know lots of people who do that with more than just phones. They're just not interested in other stuff, nor do they do the research. They just buy whatever a favored vendors puts out. Just like Apple.
24. Scuba_Steve (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Oct 2011)
Taco you and Donato couldn't be more off. Neither of you have answered any of my comments.
Most people buying the phone don't know anything about the phone. Yes more people know the name but not the device itself. Yesterday for a fact, I had a customer wanting to get the iPhone. He didn't know what the phone looked like and didn't know what it could do. His son said it was good and so that was good enough for him. After talking to him, turns out he was better off with an android phone since he is a heavy user of google products and is non mac user.
There's your real world example of why this phone sells so well. I get customers EVERYDAY who want the phone and don't even know what it looks like. I have customers EVERYDAY who pick up and android and think it's an iPhone. EVERYDAY I get customers thinking it's a 4G phone(vzw).
Most people don't have real expectations or standards when getting an iPhone so it could be terrible and they'll think that's how it's supposed to work.
Also the iPhone does not cost more unless you're buying a 64GB(vzw).
It sells more yes but from my own experience.
1 customer who knows about android to 5 customers who knows about iPhone.
It's all marketing
27. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
And there's also a ton of people buying android who know nothing about phones. You act like its exclusive to Apple users.
People recommend the iPhone to each other because it's the best phone they've ever used.
Yes it does cost more. Check bionic on sale for $130 60 days after it came out. BOGO coming soon.
What about all the android returns you get from dissatisfied users and iPhone having the lowest return rates? Is that marketing too?
51. ledbetterp3 (Posts: 467; Member since: 31 Aug 2011)
@taco And if they did know anything about phones, they would be happy they made the right choice with android.
32. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
Ok your right so apple sells more phones cause there marketing is better. Why don't they just stick a flip phone in a box a market it well and make tons of money. People hear about the iPhone because others talk about it. If they purchased it and didn't like it they would take it back. Apples profit increases more and more. Why can't you understand when something is better it will do better in sales have more publicity and people will hear more about it and want it more. If anything else was better they would sell more. Why doesn't android sell as much especially when there is so much more companies who produce them. When another company can compete with apple then u might have an argument but untill then you can't argue with pure facts.
33. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
If apple sold more just cause of advertising I think things would change. Google is not a stupid company they would quickly realize this and market the hell out of their products. Google is not going to miss out on millions of dollars just because they don't want to market there product more. So when you say it's because of marketing just sounds stupid. But I guess everyone needs a reason to justify to themshelves why there not number one for one reason or another.
41. ardent1 (Posts: 2000; Member since: 16 Apr 2011)
Who are you going to believe - some unhappy salesman with an agenda or the market surveys that interviews thousands of people. The majority of people do KNOW what cell phone they want because they did research on it. This argument about a few clueless customers is nonsense just like how several high school kids can't identify the US on a global map doesn't immediately translate into all high school kids can't ID the US on a map.
It's a phone and in today's environment, it's considered an expensive communications toy. BTW, if your customers were really intelligent, they would have bought the android device from Costco, Amazon, or some other place offering the SAME DEVICE for much less than in the store!!!
35. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
No obviously if you sell more of something that's in the same class as you. Ferrarris sells more cars then say Lamborghini so that would make there products superior. Come on do I have to point out common sense things that should be obvious for someone to see. I guess I do. And who ever sells the most does make there product superior, people buy what's is the best for the money that they decide they are going to spend. So based on the choice of the public majority by far looks like the iPhone is superior. More people choose it, more people like it, more people decided to tell their friends about it, and more people decided to keep it without returning it. Majority vote says that the product is just superior to anything else out there. If not more people would have bought something else. But they didn't, they won't and that's just how things are going to be. So just accept the facts cause apple is apple and the majority of the world loves them. And no matter what argument any wants to put up you can't change the fact more people will ways like apple.
61. Scuba_Steve (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Oct 2011)
my point is how is sales proof that it's better when customers are willing to buy it for no good reason? Also, The bionic is still being sold at 250(vzw), a 50 price drop from the original 300. Still more expensive.Yes you can grab it cheaper at other places but that's because there isn't a price lock like the iPhone. Yes there are blind followers on both sides. Apple just happens to have more. I admit I can't argue the return rates because yes android phones are more prone to malfunctions.
The flip phone idea is just obviously over exaggerated and invalid. When it comes to word of mouth yes, android does shoot itself in the foot. There are too many options and some of those options are good and some are absolutely terrible. *Customer buys droid 2 has a terrible experience. Now all androids are POS to that customer and they share that with all their friends. That was a terrible phone but it doesn't mean all androids are terrible.
It's not all marketing but that has a huge impact on it. Google has been marketing a little more and that is why you're seeing an increase in android sales. Also you're talking to a gear head. Lambos are way better than ferrarris hands down. In actuallity Ferrarris are like android however I will admit that unlike ferrarris, not all the android models are great.
I do not have an agenda. Yes I do love android way more than apple but I give credit where it's due and I just can't fully give it to apple this time. I might say good job but it won't be with full meaning.
Sadly the majority don't know, you can walk into any store and just watch the customers. You'll find out that not a lot of people do their "homework". Also you're proving my point even more dumbass. Taco and Donato at least have good arguments. *sometimes*
68. ardent1 (Posts: 2000; Member since: 16 Apr 2011)
"You'll find out that not a lot of people do their "homework". "
That IS YOUR AGENDA. The fact remains a few people who do not do their homework DOES NOT translate into everyone not doing their homework.
Scuba_Steve, you are just being unctuous as usual especially when you use the term "majority" which contradicts the market surveys.
70. Scuba_Steve (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Oct 2011)
Yes I use the term majority because it's not just a few people who I deal with, it's MOST people I and my co-workers deal with. It's not just my own opinion, I talk to other sales representatives with other carriers not just vzw. Not just in my location, but all over the state. What I've gathered from my own and others experience is that the average customer doesn't know what they're looking at. Honestly their first words are, I need a new phone(looking for a new phone) what do I qualify for?
Also, where am I saying everyone? You're throwing that term around not me.
What surveys are you talking about? Is there a survey asking how many people study what cell phone they want before buying it? Even if that's the case think of Schrodinger's cat. You won't be able to see the real results because once you studying it, you're interfering with its natural state. In other words, if they did study that, how many people were telling the truth?
71. Scuba_Steve (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Oct 2011)
By the way, just so you can't say I'm being biased, I take some or most surveys with a grain of salt.
19. bossmt_2 (Posts: 449; Member since: 13 Oct 2009)
Apple doesn't sell the most, they sell on one of if not the highest profit lines though. For example the iPhone 4S cost about 189 bucks to build a unit but sells for 649.99 retail.
Also I assume they're including tablets in this since that's where Apple has it's biggest profit advantage.
31. taco50 (banned) (Posts: 5506; Member since: 08 Oct 2009)
Yes because only cost of making a phone is parts. There's ZERO other costs.
42. bossmt_2 (Posts: 449; Member since: 13 Oct 2009)
Apple has made money for years on margin. Same thing that all "high end" products do. Whole Foods does it, restaurants do it. There are different ways to make your money, you can have a 5 star restaurant with 200 dollar tabs, churning tables once an hour or you can have fast food charging 5 bucks a meal and turn over a customer in a minute.Apple finally has a product (iPad) that dominates the mobile market and they can turn insane profits on.
15. The_Miz (Posts: 1496; Member since: 06 Apr 2011)
This is obvious. Apple sells more and makes more.
20. windowsRocks (Posts: 152; Member since: 28 Oct 2011)
This is ridiculous. Apple Steals more & sues more
25. Scuba_Steve (Posts: 79; Member since: 16 Oct 2011)
Yes, this is obvious. Good Job Miz. Something you can say that isn't complete bull. I give credit when it's due. Good Job apple, great marketing!
22. superguy (Posts: 290; Member since: 15 Jul 2011)
This just in. 84% of "facts" presented from "studies" are made up.
See, I can do it too. :p
29. gallitoking (Posts: 4718; Member since: 17 May 2011)
great job Apple.. best selling product...... in all major carriers... hmmmm
49. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
and on the month it was launched.. AMAZING!! lol if its still the best seller in 6 months, then i would be surprised.
54. gallitoking (Posts: 4718; Member since: 17 May 2011)
like Android phones last more than a month as best sellers.... Bionic?...
56. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
apple always sells more phones, when something is that good. others companys just cant compete. Look at there yearly sales, who sells the most profitable products and makes the most money o yea apple. Who controls almost 60 % of the market???? Definitely not an android phone.
66. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
60% of what market? that would BE ANDROID.. lol. Apple controls 20% or less of the world smartphone market. Android has almost 50% now.
37. ZEUS.the.thunder.god (unregistered)
iphone 5s comes with a new service "i greedy"
.. its gonna show you how you can screw anyone who is trying to innovate, doing better and how you can make this world a greedy place to live
38. donato (Posts: 22; Member since: 28 Nov 2010)
Basically excuses are like as**oles. Everybody has one and most of them stink. So everyone can put up whatever Excuse that will make them feel better it doesn't change the facts. Just re read the article a few more times apple leads the market is sales and profits. More people buy them more people like them and it is projected they will make ever more in years to come. If some one else would make a better product it would sell more, that's just plain old logic. So any can say whatever they can against apple but it's not going to change anything. Number one is number one. End of story.
47. itzmando (Posts: 115; Member since: 17 Oct 2011)
With everything going with Apple, they may be dominating the sales portion of the market, but they are profiting and expanding too quickly, they will become Nokia. Once you have reached your peak or profits, market share etc. the only way to continue is going back down by decisions made.
It will be quite hard for one company to stay a leader in an industry, there will always be something better that can and will surpass its leader competition. So do not rule out the Android OEMs as they are slowly taking profits, market share from Apple, and Apple IMHO is setting itself for the backlash its creating with the patent cases, people will hear about it through tech websites, possibly news and other outlets of the media.
Most studies that are sourced may not be reliable its been known that many of these poll websites only use small group for surveying; thus, not representing a population fairly no matter the facts, we need to see in more detail how they were conducted, by questions and people who gave surverys. Are they skewed to one side? so many factors, thats why I do not bother believing results
48. remixfa (Posts: 14255; Member since: 19 Dec 2008)
the market will dictate the price of the phone. When the market is tired of paying for apple's insane mark ups, the market will tell apple that by not paying the asking price. Apple will then respond by either reducing pricing.. or ignoring the market.. which it can afford to do, at least for a while. Eventually even all mighty apple will succumb to the market if pushed hard enough.. its just a matter of when.
55. gallitoking (Posts: 4718; Member since: 17 May 2011)
thats whay the market has the bionic at a discount and soon on the list will be the SGSII, and so many others... so just again I agree with you... thanks to that market... that the iphone sell good even on Ebay.... kudos to you
53. douglasman100 (Posts: 24; Member since: 27 Aug 2011)
i really doubt they will grow that much i pretty sure android will completely take over the industry...oh wait i forgot they already did 43% of smartphones are android and its only a matter of time until samsung over takes apple. and all you little apple fanboys shut up im not making fun of apple...we all know there successful and no one can deny that but im just saying what will more than likely happen